Friday OT - Under the Covers

[ISUCyclones2015]

Reading is a huge part of my personality. And I've started to do it even more to avoid doom scrolling. In January, I read 20 books. Some were short (under 300 pages), but 20 is 20. I enjoy romcoms and spicy romance the most, but I also like women's fiction and the occasional thriller/true crime. I also do audiobooks and tend to stick to memoirs/non-fiction for that.

Alright real talk if I may on the spicy romance part, this has been a reoccurring topic recently in my friend group and I’ll refrain from going on the tangents we’ve gone down.

I’ve read some just to understand “why” and I think it got me even more confused. I’ve read 50 shades, the Hating Game, the Kiss Quotient, and one more I can’t remember.

They’re all crazy toxic (don’t get me started on 50 Shades and I don’t mean BDSM in general, I mean the less than zero healthy communication needed for those types of relationships), insanely cheesy hallmark movie stuff, normalize behavior no woman says they want in relationships, or they hold up expectations that are unobtainable in real life.

I don’t understand why women keep gravitating towards them when they’re everything that we as men are taught by women that “aren’t right”. (I’m painting a broad brush for an attempt at brevity, I know everyone is different).

The women in my friend group have attempted to explain (then the discussion will typically go off on a random tangent shortly after). But I’m always open to hear new perspectives on it.

 

[KnappShack]

I like the "what then" books.

Like after WWII Germany, Europe, and Japan.

The events after the events.

The rise of the Soviet influence in East Germany and Poland was pretty amazing

 

[FarmerCy1]

I’ve been reading books more and more mostly to take a break from the BS in the news, but I’ve loved reading my whole life. I read mostly Non Fiction, either relating to WW2 or the founding fathers- currently reading a book about the escape (after the war), capture and trial of Adolf Eichmann, and have another WW2 book and a book about current events in the queue. On the fiction side, I typically read Steve Berry books- they do a great job of infusing historical events with suspense.

 

[cytor]

I too am a sucker for crime drama, courtroom chaos, action/adventure type books. Right now, I'm reading a book from a series about a Wyoming game warden, who always gets into trouble for stepping outside his job and solving murders or other crimes. I'll read anything from Lee Child, David Baldacci (if his books weren't so darned expensive. I can't see paying $14.95 for a Kindle book) Blake Banner, CJ Box. I used to be the same way about Michael Connelly, but he's written so many books, I get lost in the conundrum of have I read this one or not?

The Joe Pickett books. Based on your reading choices, you have outstanding taste (as do i).

 

[cytor]

Anyone ever get into ready books about the Holocaust? I've read several and find them fascinating.

 

[CascadeClone]

Alright real talk if I may on the spicy romance part, this has been a reoccurring topic recently in my friend group and I’ll refrain from going on the tangents we’ve gone down.

I’ve read some just to understand “why” and I think it got me even more confused. I’ve read 50 shades, the Hating Game, the Kiss Quotient, and one more I can’t remember.

They’re all crazy toxic (don’t get me started on 50 Shades and I don’t mean BDSM in general, I mean the less than zero healthy communication needed for those types of relationships), insanely cheesy hallmark movie stuff, normalize behavior no woman says they want in relationships, or they hold up expectations that are unobtainable in real life.

I don’t understand why women keep gravitating towards them when they’re everything that we as men are taught by women that “aren’t right”. (I’m painting a broad brush for an attempt at brevity, I know everyone is different).

The women in my friend group have attempted to explain (then the discussion will typically go off on a random tangent shortly after). But I’m always open to hear new perspectives on it.

Gods, my mom reads these and has since I can remember. SO SO SO many paperbacks with some blonde, long-haired, bare-chested pirate looking into the distance while grabbing an equally long-haired but slightly less bare-chested brunette by the waist, as she is staring up at him...

From what I understand about it all, the appeal is the fantasy - not that women REALLY want that kind of thing, or men to act like scoundrels, but that it can be fun to think about a little and a book is a safe way to do it. A lot of women have "dark/dangerous" thoughts (beyond just "spicy"), even though in reality they KNOW it isn't something they would want in a partner or relationship.

e.g. I am sure my mom wouldn't want dad to take up piracy.

 

[CascadeClone]

I don't read near as much as I should anymore. But I do still get thru LOTR, Hobbit, and Silmarillion on a cycle every couple of years. As night reading, on a plane, etc.

Never won't be my favorites, not since I found them in 3-4th grade.

 

[swiacy]

Non-fiction first person accounts. Not biographical by famous people but interesting events in average people’s lives. Angela’s Ashes & Tis are examples and great reads.

 

[MJ29]

Alright real talk if I may on the spicy romance part, this has been a reoccurring topic recently in my friend group and I’ll refrain from going on the tangents we’ve gone down.

I’ve read some just to understand “why” and I think it got me even more confused. I’ve read 50 shades, the Hating Game, the Kiss Quotient, and one more I can’t remember.

They’re all crazy toxic (don’t get me started on 50 Shades and I don’t mean BDSM in general, I mean the less than zero healthy communication needed for those types of relationships), insanely cheesy hallmark movie stuff, normalize behavior no woman says they want in relationships, or they hold up expectations that are unobtainable in real life.

I don’t understand why women keep gravitating towards them when they’re everything that we as men are taught by women that “aren’t right”. (I’m painting a broad brush for an attempt at brevity, I know everyone is different).

The women in my friend group have attempted to explain (then the discussion will typically go off on a random tangent shortly after). But I’m always open to hear new perspectives on it.

You're kind of painting with a broad brush here. "they're all crazy toxic." There certainly are books where there is toxicity, but I would not say that's true of all the books in the genre. It's also a very vast genre. There are dark romances, romantasy (romance-fantasy), romances involving ghosts/werewolves/dragons/etc, clean romances, etc. The list really does go on and on. There's a reason it's one of the top grossing genres even though women reading romance have been MOCKED for years. And it's one of the reasons I kept my reading preferences silent for so long.

I can only speak for myself, but the books I read usually do have very healthy relationships presented. But that's also because they're the ones I seek out. I have DNFed a few that I found problematic.

I do think some of the appeal is formulaic. You're all but guaranteed a happy ever after. For most in the genre, there will be a meet cute, a turning point about 40 percent in, the big spicy scene at about 60 percent, a third act breakup/conflict around 80 percent, and then resolution. It's kind of like why people like the Hallmark Christmas movies even though they're very cookie cutter --- predictable brings some comfort.

 

[ISUCyclones2015]

You're kind of painting with a broad brush here. "they're all crazy toxic." There certainly are books where there is toxicity, but I would not say that's true of all the books in the genre. It's also a very vast genre. There are dark romances, romantasy (romance-fantasy), romances involving ghosts/werewolves/dragons/etc, clean romances, etc. The list really does go on and on. There's a reason it's one of the top grossing genres even though women reading romance have been MOCKED for years. And it's one of the reasons I kept my reading preferences silent for so long.

I can only speak for myself, but the books I read usually do have very healthy relationships presented. But that's also because they're the ones I seek out. I have DNFed a few that I found problematic.

I do think some of the appeal is formulaic. You're all but guaranteed a happy ever after. For most in the genre, there will be a meet cute, a turning point about 40 percent in, the big spicy scene at about 60 percent, a third act breakup/conflict around 80 percent, and then resolution. It's kind of like why people like the Hallmark Christmas movies even though they're very cookie cutter --- predictable brings some comfort.

If it came off as mocking, that wasn’t the intention. I am genuinely just trying to understand and appreciate your response.

I didn’t mean all were toxic… there was an “or” at the end there, so maybe a more succinct way to say my statement would be they fall into one of those 4 categories: toxic, unobtainable, overly cheesy, or normalizing bad behavior.

They’re definitely very popular for a reason and just trying to get info as to why. As someone in the dating world and wanting someone that is at least somewhat well read, romance books come up a lot. So I continue to ask various people for different perspectives until it “clicks”.

The cookie cutter/formulaic analogy I haven’t heard before and that brings some clarity to me; also why I might be so turned off (pun not intended) when I read them, I hate predictably when I read.

 

[coolerifyoudid]

I gravitate towards fantasy (Tolkien, Donaldson, Saberhagen) and mystery/spy (Lincoln and Child, Lee Child, etc) with some random classics and other fiction thrown in there (Slaughterhouse 5, Watership Down, The Martian)

If I do non-fiction, I'm more apt to grab a National Geographic magazine that covers a war, location or an era and just pour through it. Their overall quality has dropped over the years, but I do enjoy when they attribute a whole issue to something like the Civil War.

 

[coolerifyoudid]

If you get into a book and you don't like it, do you hate-read the rest of it, or are you ok stopping, even if you're a quarter or a half way through it?

I used to hate-read it to see if it got better, but as I've gotten older, I'm perfectly fine stopping and not wasting any more time on something I don't enjoy.

I've found that two things that will kill my enjoyment of a fiction/fantasy book are:
1) badly written dialogue
2) poorly written battle sequences

 

[wenkeej]

Strictly fiction here. Mostly thriller/horror/mystery.

1. The Dark Tower Series - Stephen King was unlike anything I had ever read
2. The Passage Series - Justin Cronin. Very King like with more of a "literary" approach.
3. Anxious People - Fredrick Backman. A super fast read about a bank robbery, hostage situation, and idiots.
4. Incursion - Blake Crouch. Was recommended this one on Goodreads and took a chance. Really cool story that doesn't use too much brain power.
5. Starter Villain - John Scalzi. Spy thriller with cats.

Was going to post this. I have all the Dark Tower and Dark Tower tangential hardcopies. Really the only books I own. Have completed the whole collection 3 times. Always love it, even the not so good tangential books (looking at you "Black House" and your stupid 2nd person writing perspective).

 

[Saul_T]

Was going to post this. I have all the Dark Tower and Dark Tower tangential hardcopies. Really the only books I own. Have completed the whole collection 3 times. Always love it, even the not so good tangential books (looking at you "Black House" and your stupid 2nd person writing perspective).

I've only completed the journey once and have not branched out into the Talisman books. I do love finding the path of the beam in other King works. Long days and pleasant nights to you, sai gunslinger.

 

[cytor]

The only book I stopped reading about half way through was The Keith Richards autobiography. It was horribly written. Totally disjointed, no flow to it at all.

 

[coolerifyoudid]

The only book I stopped reading about half way through was The Keith Richards autobiography. It was horribly written. Totally disjointed, no flow to it at all.

My daughter was a soccer player and was big Carli Lloyd fan when she was younger. We ended up getting her book and got it signed when she came through KC. Woof, that was not a good read.

My wife kept trying to get me to read this fantasy book series (I don't even remember what is was anymore). I got about 200 pages into it, and the battle scenes were just terrible. I could not picture anything that was happening. No scenery, no action, nothing. I've since directed her to some better authors and she actually hinted that I might have been right.

 

[wenkeej]

I've only completed the journey once and have not branched out into the Talisman books. I do love finding the path of the beam in other King works. Long days and pleasant nights to you, sai gunslinger.

And my you have twice the number.

 

[CascadeClone]

The only book I stopped reading about half way through was The Keith Richards autobiography. It was horribly written. Totally disjointed, no flow to it at all.

Maybe it was supposed to be that way, to mirror his life lol.

 

[CascadeClone]

If you get into a book and you don't like it, do you hate-read the rest of it, or are you ok stopping, even if you're a quarter or a half way through it?

Worst book I ever read was Eragon. Kid had it from school, thought it would be fun. Straight trash. Just formulaic. And lots of stuff is, but at least there's something good enough in it that you can ignore that its "hero's journey" for the billionth time. But it didn't have any of that. Kept waiting for an original idea, but the next chapter was always just another trope.

If someone wrote it today, you'd just assume it was AI autogenerated slop.

 

[cytor]

Maybe it was supposed to be that way, to mirror his life lol.

I agree. He must have been high when it was written.