Toughest Bracket Thoughts

[Ryan Rohlk]

I know many of you had problems listening to the radio on Sunday vs NDSU, it's frustrating for everyone on both ends when that happens. Anyway, Andy and I were talking about how tough both 157 became this year with Larkin moving up, and 133 with Jax making an appearance.

We started talking about toughest all-time brackets and I immediately thought of Metcalf's bracket when he won with 6 champions (Jordan Burroughs among others) and 2 runner-ups. The only one I could think of that was comparable would be David Carr's from 2 years ago with 5 champions in it.

What do you guys think, what am I missing? And which is tougher this year, 157 or 133 if Jax goes?

 

[CycloneVet]

Carrs 165 was absolutely nasty. Dean Hamiti didn’t all American if I remember right.

 

[Ryan Rohlk]

Carrs 165 was absolutely nasty. Dean Hamiti didn’t all American if I remember right.

Andy said that David's bracket aged like fine wine, with all the champs coming from it. And wasn't the Cornell kid who beat david at CKLV, and then ducked him in Nashville, seeded 2nd or something like that and didn't place as well?

I really wanted Hamiti in Ames the following season

 

[ISU22CY]

Davids 165 title run was next level. Think about it... gets beat at CKLV AND doesn't win the Big12s with the loss to KOT. Ends up as the 4 seed. 2nd round has to take out eventual AA Garvin, Quarters takes out the 5 seed in Hamiti, takes out the 1 seed KOT in the semis then has to take out the cracked out MM who was the 2 seed in the finals.

 

[crablegs]

I think 2018 125 was super tough. Multiple NCAA champs with Spencer, Suriano, Tomasello, and Cruz.

This year, it taking 133 as the tougher weight than 157. I actually don’t know what the argument is for 157.
133 has 7 previous AAs
Defending NCAA champ Byrd
2x finalist Ayala
Previous AAs - Knox, Frost, Van Dee, Fugitt, Crookham

At 157 only has 5 previous AAs
Defending champ - Taylor
No previous finalists
Previous AAs - Shapiro, Watters, Zerban, Cardenas

So the question comes down a bit to the new younger guys:
At 33 you have Jax, Davino, Blaze, and Larkin
At 57 you have Duke, Robideau, Larkin

133 clearly has better talent from a previous NCAA standpoint, and also better young talent.

 

[TheJackWePack5]

I tend to agree that 133 is deeper with more overall level talent.

If any of Byrd, Crookham, Davino, Blaze, or Jax (yes I think he goes**) won, I wouldn’t be surprised. Outside of those 5 I would be.

Whereas, if anyone outside of Duke, Shapiro or Robideau won I would be a bit surprised (no I do not think Taylor wins again and i will even be a little surprised if he finishes top 4). I think the straight forward style of Duke and Robideau will give Waters and Larkin some trouble, and Shapiro will outscramble those two.

**With this said, I don’t agree with Jax going this year. They likely are not getting first regardless of if he goes or not, so I don’t think he should go.

 

[Ryan Rohlk]

I tend to agree that 133 is deeper with more overall level talent.

If any of Byrd, Crookham, Davino, Blaze, or Jax (yes I think he goes**) won, I wouldn’t be surprised. Outside of those 5 I would be.

Whereas, if anyone outside of Duke, Shapiro or Robideau won I would be a bit surprised (no I do not think Taylor wins again and i will even be a little surprised if he finishes top 4). I think the straight forward style of Duke and Robideau will give Waters and Larkin some trouble, and Shapiro will outscramble those two.

**With this said, I don’t agree with Jax going this year. They likely are not getting first regardless of if he goes or not, so I don’t think he should go.

I think Jax 100% goes this year.

 

[crablegs]

I tend to agree that 133 is deeper with more overall level talent.

If any of Byrd, Crookham, Davino, Blaze, or Jax (yes I think he goes**) won, I wouldn’t be surprised. Outside of those 5 I would be.

Whereas, if anyone outside of Duke, Shapiro or Robideau won I would be a bit surprised (no I do not think Taylor wins again and i will even be a little surprised if he finishes top 4). I think the straight forward style of Duke and Robideau will give Waters and Larkin some trouble, and Shapiro will outscramble those two.

**With this said, I don’t agree with Jax going this year. They likely are not getting first regardless of if he goes or not, so I don’t think he should go.

I don’t like this thinking. Is first the only thing that matters? Isn’t second much better than 5th? They’re not any better positioned for beating PSU next year either.

We saw this play out with Arnold and Iowa. Iowa decided to hold onto Arnold’s RS and ended up without a trophy. Now he’s sitting and wasting a year on the bench.

 

[TheJackWePack5]

I don’t like this thinking. Is first the only thing that matters? Isn’t second much better than 5th? They’re not any better positioned for beating PSU next year either.

We saw this play out with Arnold and Iowa. Iowa decided to hold onto Arnold’s RS and ended up without a trophy. Now he’s sitting and wasting a year on the bench.

Fair point and I could be convinced. I also think it’s fair to say they could get 2nd without burning his RS.

Getting 1st isn’t all that matters, but it’s clear that’s the expectation with what they’ve invested in OSU Wrestling/Taylor.

I’m just looking at 4 years down the road with Jax, Zinken, Rainey twins, DreShaun, etc.

 

[crablegs]

Fair point and I could be convinced. I also think it’s fair to say they could get 2nd without burning his RS.

Getting 1st isn’t all that matters, but it’s clear that’s the expectation with what they’ve invested in OSU Wrestling/Taylor.

I’m just looking at 4 years down the road with Jax, Zinken, Rainey twins, DreShaun, etc.

Looking forward 4 years is somewhat pointless these days. We have no idea how weights will shake out between all of those guys, if injuries will occur, or the most likely scenario of transfers. Looking past next year in this day and age is almost impossible.

 

[TheJackWePack5]

Looking forward 4 years is somewhat pointless these days. We have no idea how weights will shake out between all of those guys, if injuries will occur, or the most likely scenario of transfers. Looking past next year in this day and age is almost impossible.

Fair points.

 

[Bucklara]

Davids 165 title run was next level. Think about it... gets beat at CKLV AND doesn't win the Big12s with the loss to KOT. Ends up as the 4 seed. 2nd round has to take out eventual AA Garvin, Quarters takes out the 5 seed in Hamiti, takes out the 1 seed KOT in the semis then has to take out the cracked out MM who was the 2 seed in the finals.

This was it, IMO. In succession, goes through 1 time champ, 2 time champ, 3 time champ(likely). This doesn’t even account for KOT/DC being arguably one of the best all-time series of matches or the buzz around MM.