3 point shooting vs Michigan

Statefan10

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I just don’t understand why some players are allowed to play through defensive mistakes but others aren’t. We are so bad offensively that I think Tre needs to be given a real chance to stay on the floor. We only have 1 guard right now that has proven he should play over 25 minutes per game. There’s going to be a game where Tre hits 3-4 big threes for us if you play him. Can’t expect him to do anything positive in 7 minutes. I just don’t see him as our 9th man like he’s been the last 3 games.
I don't disagree with anything you just said. I think it more has to do with how it sometimes goes for a freshman. I would definitely like to see him play more and shoot more, as well as Grill. I think we have to get those two more looks when they come into the games because I honestly believe both of those guys are the best true shooters on the court. Hopefully that starts happening!
 

amishclone

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It's gonna be kind of hard for me to get emotionally invested in a team that can't be bothered to make its free throws.
 
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Thompsonclone

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I don't disagree with anything you just said. I think it more has to do with how it sometimes goes for a freshman. I would definitely like to see him play more and shoot more, as well as Grill. I think we have to get those two more looks when they come into the games because I honestly believe both of those guys are the best true shooters on the court. Hopefully that starts happening!
I agree. We have to find a way to get Grill and Jackson 3-4 three attempts per game.
 
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Statefan10

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I agree. We have to find a way to get Grill and Jackson 3-4 three attempts per game.
Three point shooting is contagious. See one go in and it could snowball effect onto everyone else. That's why I think things will start to get better. Not tremendously better because I just don't think we're going to be a great shooting team, but I think it will improve. Getting those guys looks would definitely help.
 

bosco

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West Virginia is an example of a program that wins at the defensive end year after year because they rarely have a good perimeter shooting team, and Nolan Richardson's Arkansas teams were famous for 40 minutes of hell. However, there aren't too many teams that have won consistently without an outside threat.

I think good coaches change adapt their system to fit their players' strengths rather than forcing players to adapt to their system. It will be really interesting to see the approach Prohm takes.
One part coach's adapting another part players buying in. Looks to me the team is still trying to run the same offense when it had 3 NBA players. Can't tell if that's what the coaches want or if that's the players doing what they want.
 

CascadeClone

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Prohm isn't going to give Jackson and Grill tons of minutes, they are behind Bolton and Nixon. And he is going to stick with his seniors (Solo and MJ) and play big - and slow. Today, that more or less played right into Michigan's strengths.

Personally, I think I would play the kids more and go small ball, I mean why not give it a try? Unless Bolton and Nixon suddenly start shooting somewhere near 40% from deep, this team is nowhere near the bubble.
 

Statefan10

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Prohm isn't going to give Jackson and Grill tons of minutes, they are behind Bolton and Nixon. And he is going to stick with his seniors (Solo and MJ) and play big - and slow. Today, that more or less played right into Michigan's strengths.

Personally, I think I would play the kids more and go small ball, I mean why not give it a try? Unless Bolton and Nixon suddenly start shooting somewhere near 40% from deep, this team is nowhere near the bubble.
I mean this is a little bit of a knee jerk reaction considering the guys on the post game show, including Seth Greenberg, said he believed both Michigan and ISU would be tournament teams. We shot awful today, didn't play good defense, and we were still very much in the game until the last 45 seconds or so.
 

herbicide

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I mean this is a little bit of a knee jerk reaction considering the guys on the post game show, including Seth Greenberg, said he believed both Michigan and ISU would be tournament teams. We shot awful today, didn't play good defense, and we were still very much in the game until the last 45 seconds or so.
The shooting awful isn't just this game. It is now 33-124, which is 26.6%. Take out the first game, and it becomes 20-89, which is 22.5%.

Overall we are ranked 317/353. Exclude the first game, we'd be 348/353.

The 3pt shooting concerns are not a knee jerk reaction. At some point the law of averages should kick in and correct this, which means we're either in for some good games, or that law already has kicked in...
 
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HitItHard58

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Three point shooting is contagious. See one go in and it could snowball effect onto everyone else. That's why I think things will start to get better. Not tremendously better because I just don't think we're going to be a great shooting team, but I think it will improve. Getting those guys looks would definitely help.
It will improve because a team would almost have to try to shoot as poorly from 3 as we have. I think we could improve the percentage significantly by taking more off drive and kicks and dumping down low and passing back out when the D collapses. Passing around the perimeter until there’s 5 on the shot clock and tossing one up with a defender in good position just isn’t going to work consistently. Maybe I’m wrong and we just don’t have shooters like some people seem convinced of but I really don’t buy that.
 
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Statefan10

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The shooting awful isn't just this game. It is now 33-124, which is 26.6%. Take out the first game, and it becomes 17-89, which is 19.1%.

Overall we are ranked 317/353. Exclude the first game, we'd be 351/353.

The 3pt shooting concerns are not a knee jerk reaction.
Obviously we are not shooting very well, and again I don't think we'll be as good of a 3 point shooting team as last year's, but through our first 4 games last season which included the game against Arizona, we were shooting 29% from the 3. Take out our best game from that first 4 games and we would've been at 26%. We shot 16.7% against Arizona last season.

The point is that we have not shot well, but that can change. Lets wait a little bit. No one, including Halliburton, has shot the ball even remotely well. Guys like Grill and Jackson will see more minutes and could help raise that percentage too.

The knee jerk reaction was in part to saying Nixon and Bolton need to be near 40% for us to be near the bubble. I mean, all they had to do was be near 30% in this game and we would've won and no one would be on here complaining.
 

herbicide

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Obviously we are not shooting very well, and again I don't think we'll be as good of a 3 point shooting team as last year's, but through our first 4 games last season which included the game against Arizona, we were shooting 29% from the 3. Take out our best game from that first 4 games and we would've been at 26%. We shot 16.7% against Arizona last season.

The point is that we have not shot well, but that can change. Lets wait a little bit. No one, including Halliburton, has shot the ball even remotely well. Guys like Grill and Jackson will see more minutes and could help raise that percentage too.

The knee jerk reaction was in part to saying Nixon and Bolton need to be near 40% for us to be near the bubble. I mean, all they had to do was be near 30% in this game and we would've won and no one would be on here complaining.
If they were 30% and everything else stayed the same it (and Oregon St) would be wins.
 

CloneGuy8

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Watching this 3 point shooting
MXaFDjJ.jpg
 
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Sigmapolis

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If they were 30% and everything else stayed the same it (and Oregon St) would be wins.

With everything else we have going for us, we do not need to be an elite shooting team to be good. We just need to be a mediocre one -- but we are not there yet.

I think it is reasonable for people to want to see it first before saying it is "fixed," even if the historical evidence says this is just a slump for the individual guys.
 
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Statefan10

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If they were 30% and everything else stayed the same it (and Oregon St) would be wins.
Definitely will agree with that. However we also win both of these games with better defensive play. I think we'll meet in the middle with all of this. Get better defensively because I do think we could be really tough playing like we do, and improve the 3 point percentage. That doesn't mean we have to jack more to make more, because I don't think that'll help at all. Take quality shots within the offense.
 

Statefan10

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It will improve because a team would almost have to try to shoot as poorly from 3 as we have. I think we could improve the percentage significantly by taking more off drive and kicks and dumping down low and passing back out when the D collapses. Passing around the perimeter until there’s 5 on the shot clock and tossing one up with a defender in good position just isn’t going to work consistently. Maybe I’m wrong and we just don’t have shooters like some people seem convinced of but I really don’t buy that.
I agree on this and also not taking a few three pointers in transition when you're not completely wide open. There were a few times today where we took some threes where they were way too early in the possession to take them, especially when you've been struggling in that area.
 

herbicide

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With everything else we have going for us, we do not need to be an elite shooting team to be good. We just need to be a mediocre one -- but we are not there yet.

I think it is reasonable for people to want to see it first before saying it is "fixed," even if the historical evidence says this is just a slump for the individual guys.
I was hoping a change in venues would show some positive results. Though as Hines wrote, each game that goes along with the same shooting results makes more of a norm and less of an outlier. A few more of these performances in a row will justify the push of the panic button.
 

HitItHard58

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I agree on this and also not taking a few three pointers in transition when you're not completely wide open. There were a few times today where we took some threes where they were way too early in the possession to take them, especially when you've been struggling in that area.
Yeah I've always believed you don't want guys getting gun shy and overthinking but you also have to get away from what isn't working. It's a fine line for sure. I really think our bread and butter this year and what will set up the rest of our offense is Haliburton and Bolton driving. Good things happen when those two go at the rim.
 

HitItHard58

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I was hoping a change in venues would show some positive results. Though as Hines wrote, each game that goes along with the same shooting results makes more of a norm and less of an outlier. A few more of these performances in a row will justify the push of the panic button.
Why wait? Plenty of our fans hit the damn thing before the season even started. I can see how this season could be a rough one but I'm skeptically optimistic and looking forward to watching it play out.
 

ClonesFTW

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Tre Jackson will be utilized more when the game slows down for him. Right now it seems pretty clear he’s still adjusting to the pace by the way he keeps fumbling the ball. Fully expect him to be a double digit scorer next year.
 
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