Question about Rhoads' comments regarding stadium upgrades

[Clonefan32]

This comment rubbed me the wrong way. My initial reaction was this:

Hey Paul, I don't want to hear your thoughts and opinions as to the limits of our fan-base which continues to ramp up year after year, when the issues with the program are clearly all about the limits of you and your staff's coaching ability and lack of improvement on the field.

You can't tell me that when we are selling 41,000 season tickets with multiple sell outs for a team with one winning record in the past 8 years that substantial growth to those numbers wouldn't occur on the heels of an 8 or 9 win season.

I couldn't agree more. These comments bug me on several different levels. First, this is the kind of comment a coach with a 10 win team would have if he wasn't filling up a stadium. Don't complain, in any way, about the limitations of your fanbase when you put a 2 win team out on the field. People have supported this program for the last 4 years despite the team being absolutely mediocre. To even imply a lack of support is ridiculous.

Also, what a wonderful recruiting pitch this is. No matter how well we do, we have about 52,000 fans who will come to games. Why on Earth would you think it wise to put a ceiling on such a thing? This is the same guy who said, only a few years ago, he wanted to see a day where it was impossible to get an ISU ticket. How can he go from such idealistic thoughts to being conservative about expectations? To me, I think he got comfortable being CPR, who could say and do anything with passion and get away with it. Now he is dealing with not living up to expectations, and this is an attempt to temper expectations and not let people look too optimistaclly at the future.

 

[Clonefan94]

I'm kind of torn on this one. for the most part, I agree with Rhoads on this one. It should be about environment, not seats. At the same time though, looking at it financially, it might be a bit of a mistake to not go overboard just a bit. Yeah, bragging about a sellout is all fine and dandy. But what happens in five years if this thing does turn around and the seat demand ends up around 60K - 65K? Without another big donor, we aren't going to be able to expand quickly enough, or at all. Look what happened last time we decided to go in phases.

I'm definitely not saying we should go to 70K at all, but I just don't think leaving it at around 55K is a good idea financially. Once you break the ground, wouldn't it be cheaper, in the long run, to just go ahead and add another 5K seats, to make sure we won't need to expand soon?

I just have this fear, with how long it took for us to get here, that if things finally, ever did go right for ISU football, we'd wish we had a few extra seats, instead of hoping for a donor to throw in, what might need to be $50million to get that next phase kicked off.

Either way though, this isn't really about more seats. I'd really like to see us not use that grass at all. Get buts in the seats, grass and a little landscaping looks better for covering empty seats than a tarp.

 

[CyFan61]

I don't think the students will be moving to the SEZ. The SEZ is where high-dollar suites will go I think.

 

[Judoka]

I don't like the idea of moving the students. The students are the whole reason there is a university and are the donors of the future. They should have decent seats.

 

[cytown]

ISU would need to win the Big12 title, a couple times, before there would be enough bandwagon fans for 65k. You may not like it, but its reality.

 

[Judoka]

ISU would need to win the Big12 title, a couple times, before there would be enough bandwagon fans for 65k. You may not like it, but its reality.

If we had a 65k stadium this season we would have had 65k butts in the seats for UNI, Iowa, and Texas. And probably sold around 60k for Oklahoma State and TCU, though I don't think everyone would have showed up.

 

[snowcraig2.0]

ISU would need to win the Big12 title, a couple times, before there would be enough bandwagon fans for 65k. You may not like it, but its reality.

That's pure ********. You are telling me that our 55k per game we are getting now is more than 85% of our total possible fans that could attend games? Because I would say if we won a Big 12 title virtually every Cyclone fan out there that has the means would be attending games, yet you say that number would not be 65k? You don't think a Big 12 title would be worth 15% jump in attendance?

 

[D UP Clones]

Nothing about a tiny stadium looks big time. Mineesotas and baylor etc look tiny and anything but big time. Not impressed.

Furthermore iowa rarely sells out and yet their stadium looks full. Remember them calling less than 65000sold out. Yep they have been doing it for years

Total capacity needs to be over 60, 000. Even at 55, 000 actual people at a game it would still look full.

Not recognizing the growth of the student body and the renewed pride in isu would be a big mistake. Ratcheting up prices will have a bigger effect on attendance than anything else.

There are far more variables that go into planned capacity


than simply doing a slope analysis:

- Our program was a complete joke in 1995. Attendance had nowhere to go but up.
- Misuse of a chart like that predicts infinite increases in attendance to perpetuity (which we know wont happen)
- Pollard has been selling a dream and people have been buying like crazy. A 3-9 season this year followed up with similar in 2014 will drop attendance big time. We don't want to have to buy a tarp for these seats.
- Better seats equal higher cost. Hillsides for 99 bucks will likely be gone - that will push some families out of their comfort zone.
- We are the 2nd most popular BCS program in our state - a state that only has 3 million people.
- A packed stadium of smaller size (like Minnesotas) looks way better than 75k with empty tops (like Kinnick)

 

[cytown]

Nope, I don't. And I've heard Jamie talk about it more than once too. Capacity wont go over 60k with this expansion. I have a hunch that if the demographics changed big time, and we needed to expand, the east side would get a second teir. This isn't a 65k+ at every football game program. The "build it and they will come" mentality is rubbish. We sell out for 5 straight seasons and win a Big 12 title in there - then maybe it can be discussed. But even then, its a big stretch.

 

[im4cyclones]

I would rather it be built to accommodate 55k of actual seats and then take $5 million of it and put up another monstrous scoreboard in the south end! Hell yeah!

 

[Clonefan32]

ISU would need to win the Big12 title, a couple times, before there would be enough bandwagon fans for 65k. You may not like it, but its reality.

That's complete ********.

In 2011 we had crowds beyond 55K twice, once for the Iowa game (we were 1-0 heading into) and once for the Texas game (we were 3-0 heading into).

In 2012, we had crowds beyond 55k 3 times, for the Western Illinois game (2-0 heading in) , Oklahoma game (5-3 heading in) and Kansas State game (4-1 headed in). We had 54,900 for the Tulsa game (season opener).

In 2013, we had crowds beyond 55k 3 times, for Okie State (1-5 heading in), Iowa (0-1 heading in) and UNI (season opener).

If we can put 55k people in seats with teams that are marginally good, you can't tell me it would take being Big 12 champs to find another 10k people to come to a game.

 

[istater7]

I would rather it be built to accommodate 55k of actual seats and then take $5 million of it and put up another monstrous scoreboard in the south end! Hell yeah!

Jack Trice Stadium: Where you never have to put your eyes on the field, only on our giant *** videoboards

 

[CycloneErik]

ISU would need to win the Big12 title, a couple times, before there would be enough bandwagon fans for 65k. You may not like it, but its reality.

In the early part of the season, we were sold out and turning people away for a program that hadn't sniffed 8 wins yet, much less won a conference title.

Selling 60-65k wouldn't be that difficult around here, as long as there's some kind of hope and excitement.

 

[Clonefan32]

In the early part of the season, we were sold out and turning people away for a program that hadn't sniffed 8 wins yet, much less won a conference title.

Selling 60-65k wouldn't be that difficult around here, as long as there's some kind of hope and excitement.

I think this years Oklahoma State game is most telling. 56,800 (maximum capacity) for a game where we are 1-4 coming off losing 71-7 to Baylor. If we can fill a stadium for that game, we can get 65,000 with a marginally competitive team.

 

[Tre4ISU]

I don't think every one is considering we are adding the cheapest seats in the stadium. (except hillside). If you have 3-5K empty seats every game it will eventually drag down all ticket prices.

Consider this: 56K seats at $400 per season = $22.4M
If you stay at 56K and demand goes up to $450 per season = $25.2M
If you increase to 62K seats and demand and/or average price drops, and you have to lower price to $350 per season = $21.7M

I know it is not exactly this simple but much like CPR wanting to play in front of a sold out crowd, having consistent sell outs creates demand which = higher prices = more revenue.

Holy crap, someone understand economics.

 

[isufan]

Someone with photshop skills should do a pic with a bowled in lower deck, then club seating and stuff above that, similar to what clemson did.

 

[cytown]

It really goes beyond just a raw attendance numbers. Some of you get into a religious fever over this stuff, but, common sense has to persevere. This is the stuff JP is great at, though. He is a numbers guy. If he says 55k is optimal capacity, then its optimal. If its 58, then its 58. No doubt there will be a meltdown when its not announced that capacity is 60 or 65k, but that's fine.

 

[CyCy]

I'm curious what the projected ticket price will be for SEZ seats. Currently season tickets are $125 for hillside and $175 SEZ bleachers. Would the SEZ tickets be priced at full price of $375 or more like the Cardinal and Gold sections toward the ends of the stands at $175-$225.

 

[ISUAgronomist]

Someone with photshop skills should do a pic with a bowled in lower deck, then club seating and stuff above that, similar to what clemson did.

From @CycloneUniforms (twitter acct)

 

[ianoconnor]

Someone with photshop skills should do a pic with a bowled in lower deck, then club seating and stuff above that, similar to what clemson did.

Someone did. I don't feel like searching through old threads with my phone, but it's out there. Was posted yesterday.

*edit: see Agronomist's post!