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jbhtexas

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Oct 20, 2006
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Arlington, TX
Yeah if only there was a way for CY/Fisher to get money for the things they need. Whats that thing the athletic department does? Fund raise? Donations?

I say we take the money (approx. a milli right?) we are using to subsidize See Why Stephens and get the baseball team fired back up. ISU Baseball coming 2022.
If CY/Fisher are to be part of the infrastructure to satisfy the cultural/fine arts element of ISU's mission, they really shouldn't depend on fund raising for financing. Donations can certainly be a component, but if donations fall short, the money needs to be there from somewhere else (i.e. tuition, the state allocation, etc.).

Also, I don't think ISU's cultural/fine arts mission obligates ISU to include the city of Ames. The city of Ames certainly could be a part of it. Ames is a "big boy", and it should be able to take care of serving the cultural needs of its citizens without mooching off of ISU. Obviously, it makes a great deal of sense for ISU and Ames to work together, but the decades-old adversarial relationship between the two seems to be as strong as ever. I just don't get that. Is this typical for college towns? I live in one now...UTA and the various interests in the city of Arlington seem to cooperate quite will on the whole. Perhaps that is because UTA is right next to Arlington's "downtown", so they both have a mutual interest in the success of that part of town.
 

BryceC

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Justify it all you want. I'm not even against the subsidy. Just don't pretend its not a subsidy any more than the million a year the university kicks in to Stephens which also benefits a large number of students. On the AD end, essentially, 85% of students are subsidizing tickets for 15% (which seems pretty similar to Jamie's claims that others were having their tickets subsidized), and guaranteeing 10% of the AD's ticket sales. Also, your math is just a bit off considering a large chunk of the student section's seats are actually equivalent to the $325 tickets on the other side
I am actually against it. The athletic department is incredibly profitable. It might not be Ohio State but there is no reason to be taxing the students for sports.
 

MustardTiger

Active Member
Apr 4, 2019
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If CY/Fisher are to be part of the infrastructure to satisfy the cultural/fine arts element of ISU's mission, they really shouldn't depend on fund raising for financing. Donations can certainly be a component, but if donations fall short, the money needs to be there from somewhere else (i.e. tuition, the state allocation, etc.).
Yes whose responsibility is it to prop up the fine arts in Ames, Iowa? Can't have cake (no fans in stands) and eat it too (CyStEpHeNs)
 

BCClone

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Sep 4, 2011
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North Iowa
I am actually against it. The athletic department is incredibly profitable. It might not be Ohio State but there is no reason to be taxing the students for sports.

I would be in favor of a $50 pass (or whatever is deemed right) and that gets you into maybe olympic sports, you get to pick two shows at fisher or CY and something like that. You would still have to buy football and MBB though.
 
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Ms3r4ISU

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May 7, 2008
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Ames
Yet, this doesn't make the ISU homepage? Hmm.
Also, interesting choice of words beginning of third paragraph, "In 2019, the athletics department was placed in charge of management of the Iowa State Center as part of ongoing efforts to further reduce costs and also generate more attendance at events, by creating greater efficiency, productivity and innovation in university programs and services."
 

theshadow

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Apr 19, 2006
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Yet, this doesn't make the ISU homepage? Hmm.
Also, interesting choice of words beginning of third paragraph, "In 2019, the athletics department was placed in charge of management of the Iowa State Center as part of ongoing efforts to further reduce costs and also generate more attendance at events, by creating greater efficiency, productivity and innovation in university programs and services."
What makes it an "interesting choice of words?" Here's the terminology used a year ago, when the transfer occurred:
"Management of the Iowa State Center transferred to the athletics department from the division of operations and finance, effective Aug. 1."
 

cysmiley

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Jun 30, 2012
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He's referring to Hilton that was the engine that ran the Iowa State Center. And it was concerts that paid the bills, not athletics. The AD got pretty favorable rates for their rental of the venue. I think Jamie didn't like the idea of paying rent. I'm sure after he took it over he realized that the rent was a hell of a lot cheaper than running the place.
$12oo a game in the 70's-early 80's. But that was not the issue, the Center always wanted some flexibility in the Calendar, so it could book tours. Deal was were always getting "routing shows", betweem chicago and denver; minneapolis and st louis or KC. Even between Indy and Tulsa. Rule of thumb for routing a concert tour was 7 hours truck time, Hiltoons reputation allowed (quick load ins and outs, allowed extending that to nine hours. But revenue from concerts was the centers cash cow. SO there always was conflict on the calendars. Early on there was some flexibility, dpending on coaches, opposing coaches, and departments, I know of a couple of date that were switched as far as home/away was concerned to accomodate a couple of concerts that put a hundred thousand or so into the kitty. But with TV, it even got more complicated as then the conference became the decider and not the ADs of schools. Ice got eliminated from Hilton to try and eleviate problem (there were other reasons) but this was the driver). So things change, but it was the Athletic Department that heavily affected the original university business plan
for the center

Edit: what a 100,000 worth from 1976, in todays dollars?
 
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swiacy

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Apr 9, 2009
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Two classic development issues raise their head in this discussion. #1-wealthy donor leaves massive gift (at the time) to construct edifice that is awesome and future projected cash flow predicts positive operation budget. Future arrives & projections are negative causing operation proponents to look elsewhere for needed revenue. #2- community activists have push to “grow” local economy by creating entertainment venue based on “studies and projections” that show guaranteed success. Owner of needed location, in this case ISU, is offered participation and other parties will provide rest of inputs. History shows that entertainment/ restaurant/ bar development is very sketchy. I repeat, if it’s such a great idea let private industry do their studies and let them take the risk.
 

BCClone

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Sep 4, 2011
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$12oo a game in the 70's-early 80's. But that was not the issue, the Center always wanted some flexibility in the Calendar, so it could book tours. Deal was were always getting "routing shows", betweem chicago and denver; minneapolis and st louis or KC. Even between Indy and Tulsa. Rule of thumb for routing a concert tour was 7 hours truck time, Hiltoons reputation allowed (quick load ins and outs, allowed extending that to nine hours. But revenue from concerts was the centers cash cow. SO there always was conflict on the calendars. Early on there was some flexibility, dpending on coaches, opposing coaches, and departments, I know of a couple of date that were switched as far as home/away was concerned to accomodate a couple of concerts that put a hundred thousand or so into the kitty. But with TV, it even got more complicated as then the conference became the decider and not the ADs of schools. Ice got eliminated from Hilton to try and eleviate problem (there were other reasons) but this was the driver). So things change, but it was the Athletic Department that heavily affected the original university business plan
for the center

Edit: what a 100,000 worth from 1976, in todays dollars?

$455,000
 
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cysmiley

Active Member
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Two classic development issues raise their head in this discussion. #1-wealthy donor leaves massive gift (at the time) to construct edifice that is awesome and future projected cash flow predicts positive operation budget. Future arrives & projections are negative causing operation proponents to look elsewhere for needed revenue. #2- community activists have push to “grow” local economy by creating entertainment venue based on “studies and projections” that show guaranteed success. Owner of needed location, in this case ISU, is offered participation and other parties will provide rest of inputs. History shows that entertainment/ restaurant/ bar development is very sketchy. I repeat, if it’s such a great idea let private industry do their studies and let them take the risk.
The predicted operation budget for the single edifice was always negative, considering ISU departmental use, and International Shows (London Symphony Orchestra, Berlin Philharmonic, (Don't know if Alvin Edgar (Music Dept chair) left notes on meetings. Anyway, the profitable acts, and the acts students wanted to see, were happening in arenas, plus the armory was no longer suitable for modern Basketball, so enter Hilton Coliseum, multipurpose facility, funded by bonds, backed by a student fee that was passed by the student body, Part of its revenue would support the then dream of C.Y. Stephens, and part enhance the athletic department revenue, increasing capacity for mens basketball. He wanted that ISU would become a cultural center for Iowa, exceeding the influence of EIU (Ok, just put that in there) but he did want a world class facility. and he got it. But times have changed and it lost the ability of Hilton to support it. But early on the plan worked; especially if you look at the early Ames Internation Orchestra Festival Concerts and extensive revenue producing concert activity at Hilton, and ISU students and faculty were exposed to internationally acclaimed artists. (aiofa events actually had musicians borrowing bicycles from residents and staying at their homes, and giving master classes in the music department). But I said, times change....

Edit: it was the music departments idea to get volunteers to open their homes. as Ames at that time had limited hotel space.
 
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Mr.G.Spot

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How do you define "fine arts crowd"?
And your statement is presumptuous.
Yes - it was presumptuous. I suppose I could have said most people will agree with Jamie other than the people that specifically buy tickets to the events that are held at CYS.

I was a little quick on the trigger and please note that I am a supporter of the fine arts.

There are a lot of moving parts in the key people involved from the key organizations all want this to happen.
 

Mr.G.Spot

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You're totally agreeing with something I'm not saying. You seem to want to section off the "fine arts crowd" as if these are distinct people who have no other affiliations in the campus or community. I'm sure there are some people who fit that profile but most do not. It's easy to imagine a city council member, for example, being put off by Pollard's tone during the past week and that loss of goodwill complicating Pollard's efforts to complete the entertainment district project.
I agree with you. There will be city council members that are put off by his comments, but in the end, I believe this is a project they want to see happen and understand that they all have to work together. There is a tremendous amount of public dollars at play and I comfortable with conversations being out in the open.
 

NWICY

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BCClone

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Her last line is just ludicrous. "Perhaps we should cut football, and save the arts."

She may want to consider why CY holds 2-3k and the football stadium in 61.5k. Also, if CY was pulling the large bucks, then there is no way that the university would have considered handing it over.
 
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