Officiating against Kansas and rebounding problems

Discussion in 'Mens Basketball' started by jkclone, Jan 14, 2014.

  1. jkclone

    jkclone Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2013
    Student & Iowa State Fan
    I want to start this out by saying in no way were the officials the reason we lost. That being said it did have an impact. Also I didn't find a thread that this really fit in, and I know some people get mad when there are too many threads so if it is deemed it fits somewhere else then move it.

    The officiating last night was pretty bad and if you don't think so then there are two reasons. Number one you don't understand basketball and number two you think it makes you superior because you don't criticize the officials. I have seen a decent amount of comments about the booing and such. I will start this off by talking about last year. If you don't think that last years game gave us the right to at least expect a fair game if not a favorable (getting the benefit of the doubt on 50/50 calls) then I don't know what to tell you. I would have been fine with an even game as long as Kansas didn't get obvious calls in their favor. Now why was the booing not fair. It was in response to Kansas calls and that should have been expected after last year.

    The next thing I want to get to is Embiid. I want to start of by saying he is a freak and will be a great player in the NBA. I don't think there has been a better player in college since Durant. That being said he has a temper. The first flagrant call should have been a flagrant two. This is especially true since he got thrown out of the last game for a flagrant two. I don't get how you can forearm someone in the face and at the same time throw someone to the floor and only get a flagrant 1. There was also another play latter in the game where he poked someone in the face. I don't know if they looked at it or not, but due to the fact that he has a history of flagrant fouls in the last two I think that would be a flagrant 1. The next part about his game is that he is very physical. I don't think there were major problems with that but there were a few that I thought he should have been called for specifically the Sportscenter Top Ten play one. You can't watch that and say it was clean. It was an awesome block but that doesn't mean it wasn't a foul too. The last thing about his game which he will need to change to be successful at the next level is when he does his post moves I would guess the percentage is about 50% on the number of times he hooks around the defender. I know that others like Niang will get away with it some, but Embiid is obvious about it and it should be called.

    I want to add a question for those that watched the game on tv. People have talked about the flagrant foul that the officials didn't want shown. My roommate said this was a different time then the flagrant on Embiid. He said it was on Wiggins. I was wondering which is the case as that was not shown.

    Now we can get into the ticky tack stuff that you always have. I think Kansas got the benefit of the doubt more but maybe not. The one call that stands out of me was the one where Morris was called even though he couldn't play any better defense. Now we can debate these forever but we will never agree on those so I will leave it at that.

    Now it comes to rebounding. I noticed it and talked about it after Oklahoma, but seeing it in person last night confirmed it. We will get position on box outs but are forced to go up one handed because we have to keep from being pushed completely out of the way by our opponents. This leads to the ball becoming a hot potato and allows the opponent to get the rebound or tip it out to a teammate. I don't expect this to always be called but it does need to be called sometimes. This is also where a lot of the complaining about the officials comes from the players. They are getting absolutely mauled and the officials will talk to them about not pushing on the other players. It happened a couple of times. There was one specifically after a timeout where the official was talking to Hogue and they didn't listen at all to him. Then the whole team gets mad and frustrated because you can't do anything.

    I know that Hoiberg works the officials and he has done it a lot more this year. That being said I don't know what he needs to do, but it isn't working. Maybe we need to pull a Mangino or a Rhoads and call them out. It is utterly ridiculous that we are out physicalled and yet we can't play physical back.

    I know this is a bit of a rant and such but it is beyond ridiculous. We can't always complain that it cost us the game. It didn't last night but that doesn't mean it wasn't bad. Think about it if the officiating was better we may have been able to play like absolute **** and still beat a Kansas team that played almost perfect minus the turnovers. That is why I am confident we are still a great team.
  2. RednGoldDragon

    Aug 22, 2013
    Oh, thank god, another one.
  3. AltHawk

    AltHawk Active Member

    Sep 2, 2012
    The Embiid block was clean. And the officiating was heavily slanted towards Iowa State (they shot what, 20 more free throws). Quite whining.
  4. RoseBowlBound

    RoseBowlBound Member

    Sep 13, 2011
    Iowa City via WDM
    Kansas had 9 more fouls and 15 fewer free throws.
  5. cyclone101

    cyclone101 Well-Known Member

    Oct 19, 2009
    Central IA
  6. abe2010

    abe2010 Well-Known Member

    Jan 14, 2009
    State Center, IA
    um, Wiggins didn't get a flagrant foul
  7. Cyclonesince78

    Cyclonesince78 Well-Known Member

    Mar 8, 2012
    Anyone complaining about refs last night should get the ban hammer
  8. IcSyU

    IcSyU Well-Known Member

    Nov 27, 2007
    Rochester, MN
    #8 IcSyU, Jan 14, 2014
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2014
    The officiating was fine last night. People seem to have this notion that any sort of contact is automatically a isn't. Are they going to miss some? Yes. Are they going to be right a majority of the time? Yes.

    I'm sure you weren't ******** on Hogue's flop under the bucket which drew a charge. I'm also guessing you didn't mind when Kane was tripping over himself and got the call.

    Also...the rebounding problem is we throw a bunch of 6'6" guys out there against guys over 7' and expect to rebound when we get set to box out 3 feet away from the rim. Unless the rebound comes directly off the front of the rim we have no chance because our position, while inside, is terrible.
  9. IcSyU

    IcSyU Well-Known Member

    Nov 27, 2007
    Rochester, MN
    Only a moron can say "they shot X more free throws...the officiating was slanted their way."

    That's just as stupid as "they called the same number of fouls on the teams...that's good officiating."

    Kansas plays tough defense...Iowa State gives up a lot of easy dunks and makes sense Iowa State would have more trips to the line.
  10. TheSuperiorOne

    TheSuperiorOne New Member

    Dec 15, 2013
    Did you watch the Embiid flagrant? He didn't forearm to the face. Perhaps you're confusing his flagrant from the other game.
  11. BlackHawk

    BlackHawk Member

    Sep 30, 2010

    How so? You shot 9 more 3's (25 total) and got absolutely murdered on the glass. Please explain to us "morons" how it makes sense that Iowa State shoots 15 more free throws?
  12. Bigman38

    Bigman38 Well-Known Member

    Jul 27, 2010
    Council Bluffs, IA
    after you explain how the number of FT attempts is an accurate reflection of how the reffing was.

    * I don't think the refs were bias
  13. DollaDollaBill

    Mar 2, 2010
    If anything the refs favored ISU. They let a lot of contact go all game and were pretty consistent.
    • Like Like x 1
  14. Isu128001

    Isu128001 New Member

    Dec 13, 2013
    And ku fans will say, "how about Kane tripping over his own feet, wiggins getting hacked at least 6 times in the lane and embiid jumping straight up twice and still getting foul calls"

    See how this works, if anybody thinks ku got the benefit of the officials last night they're completely blinded by loyalty and to come on here and cherry pick two or three calls you believe were bad is just awful
    • Like Like x 1
  15. bawbie

    bawbie Moderator
    Staff Member

    Mar 17, 2006
    Cedar Rapids, IA
    That is just not true. Number of free throws shot is a horrible way to judge officiating. The fact is that Kansas fouled (by design in some cases) a lot more than ISU did.
  16. Bewilderme

    Bewilderme Well-Known Member

    Apr 11, 2006
    It's pretty obvious from watching ISU's games this year that they often pull back when the other team is driving to avoid the foul but concede the bucket. Thus, we don't have as many fouls called on us because we don't contest a lot of those shots. The +/- number of fouls called has almost nothing to do with how the game is called for this ISU team.

    That said, there were a number of questionable calls for both sides last night, and a lot of times where I sat in astonishment that there was a foul called or uncalled, for both teams. The refs were letting both teams play, which wasn't good for the smaller team in this case. That wasn't the reason we lost, though.

    Refs are an easy scapegoat, but if we shoot even 25% from 3, we win that game.
  17. rholtgraves

    rholtgraves Well-Known Member

    Sep 25, 2009
    So let me get this straight. The refs only called more fouls on KU because KU wanted to foul more? So KU wanted to put ISU in the bonus that early?
    Interesting theories.
  18. IcSyU

    IcSyU Well-Known Member

    Nov 27, 2007
    Rochester, MN
    We also took significantly more shots than Kansas because they couldn't take care of the ball.

    Iowa State gives up a lot of dunks and easy buckets because we don't have a bench. It's hard to foul when you get beat and just let the guy go.

    Kansas on the other hand plays physically and has a deep enough bench they don't care if they get in foul trouble. They challenge every shot. They're going to rack up fouls that way.

    Iowa State probably got 15 trips to the line for shooting fouls and probably took about 85 shots, 60 of which were inside the arc. Kansas didn't give up more than 2 or 3 unchallenged shots. 57 shots were challenged.

    Kansas probably got 12 trips to the line for shooting fouls and took roughly 73 shots, 57 of which were inside the arc. Iowa State didn't challenge on a lot of those dunks because they can't have Ejim/Niang/Hogue in foul trouble so realistically there were 12-15 shots which weren't challenged due to either break points or not wanting to pick up a foul. 42-45 shots left to account for.

    How is that difficult to understand?
  19. Wesley

    Wesley Well-Known Member

    Apr 12, 2006
    Envr Engr/Program Manager
    Really needed more efficient shooting out of Naz, Matt, and Monte. The other players had their own matchup problems.
  20. jkclone

    jkclone Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2013
    Student & Iowa State Fan
    Ok there were a few competent comments, but most were the stupid your stupid post. I want a reasonable discussion not a name calling thread. If you want to respond to the actual post then do so, but don't waste yours and my time by making stupid comments.

    To clarify I know no flagrant was called on Wiggins. What I said was there a possible flagrant that could have been called. I never saw one, but my roommate said that is when the officials said not to show the replay I wanted to see if he was mistaken or if others were assuming that they were talking about another call.

    Also on the Embiid flagrant. I haven't seen a replay of it since last night at the game. From what I saw he had his forearm on the shoulder of I believe Hogue pushing towards his head and then threw down Kane. Either way I still believe that if he only threw down Kane it still should have been a Flagrant two due to it being the second one in two games.

    Also anyone using foul count to determine if the officiating was fair does not understand basketball.

    Again civilized discussion is what I want, not name calling about the officiating.

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