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SCarolinaCy

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Jun 20, 2011
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Coach Who Never Punts, Only Does Onside Kicks Lands FCS Job
Kevin Kelley, moves to the FCS ranks after a historic run at Pulaski Academy in Little Rock, Arkansas, that includes nine state titles and being named the USA Today High School Coach of the Year in 2016. His teams once scored 29 points before other team got the ball.
 

coolerifyoudid

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Feb 8, 2013
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Ballsy. I guess if you treat it like a part of your offense and practice it over an over again, your percentages will be higher than the normal success rate. I could see it working in the right environment.

I'm curious if it's an all-or-nothing approach, or if he exercises some recognition of game-time scenario. It would be a colossally stupid strategy if:
- you're up less than 7 points and trying to protect a lead with little time left
- you're at your own 10 yard line (or less)
 

Zyklon

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Ballsy. I guess if you treat it like a part of your offense and practice it over an over again, your percentages will be higher than the normal success rate. I could see it working in the right environment.

I'm curious if it's an all-or-nothing approach, or if he exercises some recognition of game-time scenario. It would be a colossally stupid strategy if:
- you're up less than 7 points and trying to protect a lead with little time left
- you're at your own 10 yard line (or less)
I read about his a few years ago, so my memory is hazy, but I don't think they had many scenarios when they were only up by 7 with only a little time left. I seem to remember them blowing most teams out (I could be way off).

And I think he would go for it that close to their own endzone. His reasoning was that they had better odds getting the first down then they did stopping the other team score from ~30/40 yards out. That was probably made more true by the fact that many HS kids suck at punting and are more prone to messing up. I'm guessing at the FCS level, those odds look much different. I doubt a lot of this will scale.
 

cyclones500

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basslakebeacon.com
Ballsy. I guess if you treat it like a part of your offense and practice it over an over again, your percentages will be higher than the normal success rate. I could see it working in the right environment.

I'm curious if it's an all-or-nothing approach, or if he exercises some recognition of game-time scenario. It would be a colossally stupid strategy if:
- you're up less than 7 points and trying to protect a lead with little time left
- you're at your own 10 yard line (or less)

Articles from a few years ago, I don't know if either specifically addresses those situations, but it does reveal some of the strategy behind his plan.




 

usedcarguy

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Apr 12, 2008
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Coach Who Never Punts, Only Does Onside Kicks Lands FCS Job
Kevin Kelley, moves to the FCS ranks after a historic run at Pulaski Academy in Little Rock, Arkansas, that includes nine state titles and being named the USA Today High School Coach of the Year in 2016. His teams once scored 29 points before other team got the ball.

There won't be any reading without a link! ;)
 

SoapyCy

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I think that's fantastic and coaches are so conservative that they probably don't want to implement a positive change.

No one wants to be the first one to do it because there will be failures and people will immediately call out those failures as proof of why he shouldn't coach.
 

cyclones500

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basslakebeacon.com
I posted a couple of links from articles I had read, but haven't reviewed them recently. Among things I recall -- I think an underlying premise, more general than "rarely punting," it's setting up offense as if you are going to use all 4 downs to get 10 yards (so, 2.5 yards per play), instead of a common approach of assuming you need 10 yards in 3 tries (3.33333...). N

Not a huge difference, but extended throughout an entire game of possessions, it adds up. It's enough to change the play-to-play strategy.

Other elements are factors, of course, outlined in the articles, like weighing field position risk and such (as @Zyklon noted).
 

HFCS

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Aug 13, 2010
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Always onside kicking is probably dumb, but occasional non 4th quarter inside kicks have been evaluated to be a great risk.

Coaches aren't as dumb about stupid punts as they were 20 years ago.
 

MuskieCy

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Small high school success always translates to success at a MUCH higher level.

 

cyrocksmypants

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Disagree with the almost always onside thing, as too many rules are stacked against you with too few options in an onside. I could 100% get on board with never punting though. Or at least never punting with like, 5 or less yards to go.
 
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CapnCy

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Disagree with the almost always onside thing, as too many rules are stacked against you with too few options in an onside. I could 100% get on board with never punting though. Or at least never punting with like, 5 or less yards to go.

I won't be 100% accurate with this, but I recall Heacock saying on a podcast that he see the punt as one of the best offensive plays (i.e. you don't score every drive, so its a 40+ yard play (again, not exact works he used, but a counter argument to why punting is good for overall game)
 
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cyrocksmypants

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I won't be 100% accurate with this, but I recall Heacock saying on a podcast that he see the punt as one of the best offensive plays (i.e. you don't score every drive, so its a 40+ yard play (again, not exact works he used, but a counter argument to why punting is good for overall game)
Are we shocked a defensive coordinator would think that?
 

SCarolinaCy

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I have always believed that kicking straight away to the fastest guy on the field is very risky. Likewise, squib kicks (to avoid the runback) are hit and miss and often fail.

As a routine, pooch kicks spread out randomly to the sideline would be my favorite. (With practice) Very predictable outcome. Always a chance of live ball recovery. Low risk of runback.
 
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