Level the playing field in HS athletics

[cyfanatic13]

There is 1 area where I wish Iowa would address and that is having a private school competing in smaller classes like 1A/2A sports. Specifically Des Moines Christian is one that has an unfair advantage against the small rural town schools they play. They are a private school so just like Dowling they essentially are able to "recruit" so the talent level they have compared to the small schools they play is usually very noticeable. They were in my school's conference and I remember just how mis-matched we were in basketball when their shortest player in their starting lineup was probably the same height as our tallest post player. Sean Sonderlieter who played at Iowa beat up on teams pretty easily as nearly every school in the conference had no one even close to his size to guard him. DM Christian basically makes the state tournament nearly every year because they have a fairly easy path to go through with their level of talent most years.

I get it, there are examples like this throughout time even with public schools as you can say there isn't a player in the state like Xavier Foster and at least when Harrison Barnes was playing he was at Ames and playing against good competition in the CIML and not some 1A/2A school. I don't know what the solution is other than maybe make DM Christian play in the CIML since they are a private school and other private schools around the state that can "load up" because of their private status have to play in comparable 3A/4A athletic conferences even if their school enrollment does not classify them at that level?

I am all for competition but what's the point of having classifications by school enrollment if private schools have an unfair advantage in the being able to stack their athletics when the public schools can't? A 4A school is obviously going to have a bigger pool of students than a 1A school will which is why they don't play each other. A private school also has a potentially bigger pool of students as well so why should they be allowed to play in a lower class?

DMC has made it to state basketball 2 of the last 9 years...

 

[cyfanatic13]

Totally understand it's not for everybody but reading things like Valley having 75 kids trying out for the freshman baseball team makes me extremely glad I grew up at a 1A/2A school and got to play 4 sports and also got/had to participate in every music thing (thanks mom)

 

[Cyfan1965]

Just bothers me a small town can have a once in a generation class and the Xavier's Assumption's and Wahlert's recruit you out of the game. 6 of 8 finalists in volleyball were private schools-

 

[mramseyISU]

Totally understand it's not for everybody but reading things like Valley having 75 kids trying out for the freshman baseball team makes me extremely glad I grew up at a 1A/2A school and got to play 4 sports and also got/had to participate in every music thing (thanks mom)

On the flip side to that Waterloo East and West are constantly pulling up 8th graders to play on the freshman team. I think West has been playing 3 or 4 8th graders on the Freshman team this year and East's best pitcher on Varsity is an 8th grader. The freshman class going in to West the fall of 2020 only has 5 kids that play baseball competitively. One of the Varsity assistants is a friend of mine and he said it wouldn't surprise him if they just pulled up the whole 8th grade team so they had a full team to play freshman baseball that year.

 

[BillyClone]

Just bothers me a small town can have a once in a generation class and the Xavier's Assumption's and Wahlert's recruit you out of the game. 6 of 8 finalists in volleyball were private schools-

There are 5 classes in girls volleyball in Iowa so there were 10 finalists. Of those 10, 6 were private schools. Your point remains.

 

[hoopitup]

I dont know what the answer is but it must suck for varsity coaches that have invested years into developing kids to have them transfer their Jr/Sr years. On the flip side though you cant blame the kids for trying to improve their situation. Maybe private schools have to play a class up but that doesnt help the Norths or Hoovers in football. Go to 5 classes maybe?

But that’s part of the issue. One of the big problems with the metro schools is you have coaches who are not invested for whatever reason. It takes solid leadership and an investment in the program by them and the district. It’s also all about relationships. There are a lot of coaches in DM that build relationships. There are also a lot that do not. Finding that right mix is the big challenge. This, in and of itself, won’t stop kids from transferring to Dowling, but it will help. And there are also kids transferring from the burbs to Dowling, so it’s not just a DM problem.

 

[SEIOWA CLONE]

I see many disagree with this statement. I think what he is saying is that if a school has a need to make changes to, add to, improve or renovate facilities the public school board has access to PPEL to secure funding and also has the opportunity to use local public tax dollars to fund the project by putting it up for bond vote. Private schools (and not all are as wealthy as the Dowlings and Xaviers of the world) do not have any access to these funding streams. I know it is there choice to be students/parents of a private school and they have to live with the consequences also if they can't compete with the other schools athletically for financially. To say that all private schools should be set aside from a conference is a blanket statement; just as saying those that consistently win should be set outside a conference, wether public or private. Success is success whether it is public or private. There are communities where the public is much more successful than the private.

Can you please list the communities where the public school has been more successful than the private one? Because the only one I can think of would possible be Pella with Pella Christian. Dowling is the dominate sports program in DM, Holy Trinity is better than any program in Ft. Madison or Keokuk, IC Regina more successful than IC high or West. Dav. Assumption better than any Davenport schools. So where are they schools at?

 

[GT25Ump]

Here's another one... Why The #$%^ does Iowa start baseball in late may/early June when the rest of the country plays in the spring?

As an umpire in NW Iowa, I work games in SE South Dakota & NE Nebraska (where their ball season runs from mid-March to early May), along with the summer schedule here in Iowa. To no surprise, with the "Spring" season they're lucky to get half their scheduled games in. What I hear people suggest is that they wish Iowa would start about three weeks earlier (about May 1st) and wrap up the State Tournament around July 4th, instead of extending all the way to the beginning of August. I get that...

 

[mdk2isu]

Can you please list the communities where the public school has been more successful than the private one? Because the only one I can think of would possible be Pella with Pella Christian. Dowling is the dominate sports program in DM, Holy Trinity is better than any program in Ft. Madison or Keokuk, IC Regina more successful than IC high or West. Dav. Assumption better than any Davenport schools. So where are they schools at?

FDSH > St Edmonds in most things
CF > Waterloo Columbus in most things
Lewis Central > St Albert in most things
Algona and Algona Garrigan are usually pretty equal
CR Prairie is usually close to CR Xavier
Western Dubuque and Dyersville Beckman are pretty equal
Dowling is dominate in football, not so much other sports
IC West has had a lot of success, so is probably pretty close to Regina

 

[riceville98]

View attachment 64928

Here are the locations of the 12 largest private high schools (based on enrollment in grades 9-12 only). the two dots in DSM are Dowling and Des Moines Christian. Other than DSM Christian all are Catholic schools. One of those schools plays in the highest league and another plays way down.

For those of you advocating a separate private school conference, do you A) think this geography spread is beneficial for 14-18 year old kids to play sports? or B) think a huge conference made up of schools ranging from 1,440 students (Dowling) to 187 students (newman in Mason City) is a competitive conference? Dowling has twice as many kids as the next largest private high school in the entire state. Don't you think it's better for those kids to play other schools of similar demographics, like Waukee, Ankeny, or Valley?

I can't imagine anyone thinking Wahlert in Dubuque playing St Albert in Council Bluffs is a good thing, or Heelan in Sioux City traveling to Assumption in Davenport for a Tuesday night basketball game is a good use of teenager's time.

I'd like to see it happen at least for post-season play in all sports. People may be right that it wouldn't work well for regular season play and that's fine but, we need a class P for postseason.

to respond to your points: (A Don't come in here with that--the 4A and 5A schools drive half way across the state now--look no father than the CIML conference. Also your dots are only showing the 12 biggest schools. There are plenty of private schools to go around

B) I don't want it to be 1 huge conference--you would still have to divide it up some way and that's why it may be a problem. Needs to happen for postseason though

 

[riceville98]

... Or they could increase the state funding for the DMPS schools. The reality is DMPS schools have the athletes to compete with rural schools (if not better) but by the time kids reach the varsity level, the superior training, dieting, etc. that rural schools can provide puts their teams above DMPS. Not to mention, a lot of the really good athletes end up switching to those rural schools. DMPS will have a $24 million budget cut next year (indirectly relates to athletics), it's a travesty that they are taking away even more money from the most critical part of our society's future that is already severely under-funded.

I agree that funding needs to increase across the board but, DMPS doesn't need any more $$ until the small schools get some help

 

[KidSilverhair]

FDSH > St Edmonds in most things
CF > Waterloo Columbus in most things
Lewis Central > St Albert in most things
Algona and Algona Garrigan are usually pretty equal
CR Prairie is usually close to CR Xavier
Western Dubuque and Dyersville Beckman are pretty equal
Dowling is dominate in football, not so much other sports
IC West has had a lot of success, so is probably pretty close to Regina

Plus Bettendorf has been far more successful than Assumption.

For Cedar Rapids it depends on the sport. Kennedy and Linn-Mar are better than Xavier in some sports; only a few years ago Xavier couldn't beat Wash in football.

 

[SEIOWA CLONE]

FDSH > St Edmonds in most things
CF > Waterloo Columbus in most things
Lewis Central > St Albert in most things
Algona and Algona Garrigan are usually pretty equal
CR Prairie is usually close to CR Xavier
Western Dubuque and Dyersville Beckman are pretty equal
Dowling is dominate in football, not so much other sports
IC West has had a lot of success, so is probably pretty close to Regina

Dowling has won what the last 5 titles in football, has won titles in softball and GBB, and years ago one in BBB.
IC West won 3 titles in football, that is not close to what Regina has done, what do they have 7?

The OP did not say close, he said public schools more successful than the private school. It just does not happen. Carrol HS has never had the success as Kemper. Bett has won titles in FB, but Assumption has won how many in baseball and other sports?

 

[riceville98]

Here's another one... Why The #$%^ does Iowa start baseball in late may/early June when the rest of the country plays in the spring?

I like the summer season. I think it;s sets us apart in a good way and lets kids play track/golf and Baseball/Softball plus, I like having a longer Softball season (I go to college games in the spring and HS games in the summer)

 

[mdk2isu]

Dowling has won what the last 5 titles in football, has won titles in softball and GBB, and years ago one in BBB.
IC West won 3 titles in football, that is not close to what Regina has done, what do they have 7?

The OP did not say close, he said public schools more successful than the private school. It just does not happen. Carrol HS has never had the success as Kemper. Bett has won titles in FB, but Assumption has won how many in baseball and other sports?

IC West has won titles in wrestling, and been to the state tournament in baseball and BBB recently. So Regina is good at 1 sport, that doesn't make them more successful overall.

Things cycle, Dowling is on an upswing currently. Valley went on a streak of winning like 4 or 5 straight FB titles and 4 or 5 straight baseball titles too about a decade ago. Eventually the pendulum will swing back away from Dowling.

 

[wxman1]

Plus Bettendorf has been far more successful than Assumption.

For Cedar Rapids it depends on the sport. Kennedy and Linn-Mar are better than Xavier in some sports; only a few years ago Xavier couldn't beat Wash in football.

Let's not forget how many straight soccer titles Xavier has and total overall...

 

[riceville98]

I always found it amazing how few kids were still playing by the time they were seniors.

In all seriousness though, the IHSAA needs to shorten the baseball and softball seasons. Softball especially needs to cap the number of games you can play, some teams play in tournaments every weekend.

I disagree with this on so many levels, First, there is a cap for SB/BB (40 games I think). The season needs to be longer (Sate should be in August). You have a a 6 week season and that means teams play 4-5 nights a week to get there games in) My local SB team has 3 weeknights off the whole season) .

The answer is to shorten Football and Volleyball preseason by 2 weeks. You don't need 4 weeks of practice before games in football and volleyball

 

[BillBrasky4Cy]

I disagree with this on so many levels, First, there is a cap for SB/BB (40 games I think). The season needs to be longer (Sate should be in August). You have a a 6 week season and that means teams play 4-5 nights a week to get there games in) My local SB team has 3 weeknights off the whole season) .

The answer is to shorten Football and Volleyball preseason by 2 weeks. You don't need 4 weeks of practice before games in football and volleyball

My brother in law is an AD he would disagree with you. There have been a lot of discussions of shortening baseball, softball, and basketball.

 

[BillBrasky4Cy]

I disagree with this on so many levels, First, there is a cap for SB/BB (40 games I think). The season needs to be longer (Sate should be in August). You have a a 6 week season and that means teams play 4-5 nights a week to get there games in) My local SB team has 3 weeknights off the whole season) .

The answer is to shorten Football and Volleyball preseason by 2 weeks. You don't need 4 weeks of practice before games in football and volleyball

The whole point is that teams don't need to play 40 games...

 

[SEIOWA CLONE]

IC West has won titles in wrestling, and been to the state tournament in baseball and BBB recently. So Regina is good at 1 sport, that doesn't make them more successful overall.

Things cycle, Dowling is on an upswing currently. Valley went on a streak of winning like 4 or 5 straight FB titles and 4 or 5 straight baseball titles too about a decade ago. Eventually the pendulum will swing back away from Dowling.

Hell back in the 70's Regina was winning state titles in boys bb with Mark Gannon. Name a sport that Dowling is poor at? Hell even .500 in. When does the pendulum swing away from Dowling, in the 70's they were the dominate power in football, would have won multiple titles before they actually played for them.

Use the multiplier and make religious school play up a class. If they are still successful, good for them, but right now its unfair for the smaller schools, and always has been.