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DaddyMac

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Oct 18, 2006
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Excellent!

This would have terrible implications on so many levels it is almost impossible to believe that I am reading some of the posts here. The saddest is equating him to PacMan Jones-:skeptical:

If you had an original thought that didn't involve kissing someone's else butt, or could understand context - it would be the biggest newsflash of the season. I'm sure 33 or Curt would love to sign an autograph for you, or to toss you their game jersey to go with your coca-cola.

I never compared LJ to PacMan Jones. I didn't compare anyone to Jones. I made a general comment about what our rash of personal fouls amount to - and that's breaking rules. Not "aggressive" or "intense". But rather penalties, yards lost and first downs. And the other half is that we seem to have a number of players with little interest in what effect their actions cost the team - just as long as they one-up the guy their going against or get their shot in. If you prefer I use TO, Chad Johnson or any other player - fine. But it sure as hell isn't analgous to Joe Montana, Jerry Rice or some better examples.

Enjoy your night.
 

DaddyMac

Well-Known Member
Oct 18, 2006
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Good God.

17 people out of 200+ say to boot him. We can probably rest assured that half of those wear black and gold.

If anyone is making a mountain out of a molehill - it's the clan that believes that there's a conspiracy against LJ.

Get a grip.
 

StLouisClone

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Apr 16, 2006
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This is being blown way out of proportion IMO. ISU fans tend to do that. After all, honor before victory is our motto. I love that motto, but I don't think LJ has done anything yet to bring dishonor to the school. Yes, he has been overly aggressive at times. But we're talking about a hit that occurred a fraction of a second after Clayton crossed the goal line. LJ may have made up his mind to deliver the hit not realizing just how far into the endzone the QB was. Was it that much worse than all these other things that happen in sports?

- Knockdown pitch in baseball.
- Tripping/slashing in hockey.
- Flagrant foul in basketball.

Now I'm not saying I'm proud of what happened (far from it). I just don't want to hold LJ under a microscope. Let the young man live his life. I want to continue to see him be aggressive. Hopefully no more PFs, but a player like that is probably going to get one from time to time. Some of these guys get so focused on delivering the hit they may not hear the whistle.
 

Cyclonick182

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Oct 12, 2007
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I dont aprove of the hit but he is a heck of a player and it sounds like he is quite a nice guy to boot. I hope he can get things straight and continue to lay the wood for ISU with clean plays. LJ has my support 100%.
 

jmb

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If you had an original thought that didn't involve kissing someone's else butt, or could understand context - it would be the biggest newsflash of the season. I'm sure 33 or Curt would love to sign an autograph for you, or to toss you their game jersey to go with your coca-cola.

I never compared LJ to PacMan Jones. I didn't compare anyone to Jones. I made a general comment about what our rash of personal fouls amount to - and that's breaking rules. Not "aggressive" or "intense". But rather penalties, yards lost and first downs. And the other half is that we seem to have a number of players with little interest in what effect their actions cost the team - just as long as they one-up the guy their going against or get their shot in. If you prefer I use TO, Chad Johnson or any other player - fine. But it sure as hell isn't analgous to Joe Montana, Jerry Rice or some better examples.

Enjoy your night.
DaddyMac
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Re: What does ISU do with LJ?
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Originally Posted by isufbcurt
Say what you will but I will support intensity and aggresivness always.
Now if we could do it without what amounts to cheating or acting like a bunch of Pac-man Jones wannabees.
 

DaddyMac

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Oct 18, 2006
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Wow - you learned to use the font feature. How proud.

I didn't deny writing that. Never claimed to. The operative word being "acting" as in "behaving". As in "only about me". And I just explained that with a followup post.

Like I said, if you perfer I use somebody else - that's fine. Nobody meant to imply they live their lives footstep by footstep.

I know that's tough for you to comprehend (like most things).

Haven't got the cap off that coke yet, huh? No wonder you're so upset.
 

jmb

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Wow - you learned to use the font feature. How proud.

I didn't deny writing that. Never claimed to. The operative word being "acting" as in "behaving". As in "only about me". And I just explained that with a followup post.

Like I said, if you perfer I use somebody else - that's fine. Nobody meant to imply they live their lives footstep by footstep.

I know that's tough for you to comprehend (like most things).

Haven't got the cap off that coke yet, huh? No wonder you're so upset.
really?

You couldn't think of someone other than a guy that was suspended by the NFL for questionable off-field behavior? That included a shooting that paralyzed a bystander.

Yeah, it must be me-that is struggling with context.
 

DaddyMac

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Oct 18, 2006
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really?

You couldn't think of someone other than a guy that was suspended by the NFL for questionable off-field behavior? That included a shooting that paralyzed a bystander.

Yeah, it must be me-that is struggling with context.

Fine, whatever.

CJ, TO - you name it. You got the answers. But I have a strange feeling that no matter what name I whipped out, since you and I are on opposite sides of the arguement, you'd find fault with whomever.

I've made my point, right or wrong. I've clarified my intent twice. If that's not enough for you to grasp - too bad.
 

kingcy

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How many of you that want him booted really have played football? Its a tough game players want to take you head off and you want to do the same, talk goes on, you get held, get cheap shots, things get twisted in piles, and so on. If you think you can always turn it off like that you are nuts. Granted his hit was out of line but not worth kicking him off the team for. I dont know if he played DB before but if he was only a QB in the past he may have to learn to deal with being physical every play. Give the kid a chance, its not like he suckerpunched some guy at a bar.
 
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CycloneWanderer

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Nov 4, 2007
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I've got to say DaddyMac has so far won the
Master of Tact award:
for outstanding non-use of tact in selecting a comparison in a heated thread.

Your friendly reminder to please use more tact while posting on internet forums where things you write can, and will, be used against you for the following two hours (at minimum). We all could be more tactful sometimes :yes:
 
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DaddyMac

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Oct 18, 2006
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I've got to say DaddyMac has so far won the
Master of Tact award:
for outstanding non-use of tact in selecting a comparison in a heated thread.

Your friendly reminder to please use more tact while posting on internet forums where things you write can, and will, be used against you for the following two hours (at minimum). We all could be more tactful sometimes :yes:

As I told jmb, pick the player you feel fits the role more suitably. Chad Johnson has been elimitated from contention because none of our players have ever worn a hall of fame sport jacket on the sideline, and TO because none of our players have ever whipped out a Sharpie.

I don't follow the NFL daily to know who most exactly lives their lives on and off the field to compare with.

So the brain trust here can submit a name - and I will humbly accept it.

Of course, this is also the same brain trust that has taken a 7% vote to kick LJ off the team and thinks that's tantamout to pitchforks and torches at the gates of JTS. :no:
 

CycloneWanderer

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Nov 4, 2007
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I've got to say DaddyMac has so far won the
Master of Tact award:
for outstanding non-use of tact in selecting a comparison in a heated thread.

Your friendly reminder to please use more tact while posting on internet forums where things you write can, and will, be used against you for the following two hours (at minimum). We all could be more tactful sometimes :yes:

that last part goes to everyone, not just DaddyMac. Tact is good. That is all :smile:
 

vmbplayer

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I didn't read through the whole other thread, but has anyone bothered to mention that there's been 2 times on TV this year where a cyclone has just punched someone after the play was clearly over? To me the talk of kicking LJ off the team isn't so much because of him making one cheap shot and that warranting him being thrown off the team as much as a lot of us as Cyclones are proud or ISU and what we stand for. And frankly the play so far this year when it comes to class on the field has appeared to me to be horrendous. I think it was the SDSU game where we got a PF for what looked like just punching the guy while he was down and then Sat. against UNLV on one of the 2 personal penalties on them the TV coverage showed one of our guys hitting one of theirs. Between those and things like leveling the punt returner after the fair catch call in the Iowa game we just haven't looked good from a class standpoint. I think the strong reactions to LJ are just him becoming the focal point in Cyclone fans dissapointment in the manner our team has carried themselves on the field this year.

At the bottom of the Northeast hill at Jack Trice where the players leave the field for halftime and after the game there is a brick pillar with a sign that reads "honor before victory", I think what people are reacting to is about us not looking like we have any class or honor when we play a football game, and they want to see drastic measures taken to stop that, LJ has become the unfortunate focal point


Please don't twist this into a pro Mac or anti Chiz comment either, I hugely believe Chiz can make ISU great and fully support him, but it has appeared to me this season that the coaches don't have a handle on the players emotions on the field, and it's making Iowa State look like a bunch of thugs. This is not an LJ issue, it's an Iowa State integrity issue.

I think LJ is probably a good kid as so many people have said, and is having a tough time adjusting to a non-QB position where you are in contact every down, but since he has 3 pf's and one that was a very bad looking penalty he's become a focus of all the frustration.

Just my 2 cents, it may not mean anything to anyone but that's how I'm viewing this situation.
 

rebelx

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Sep 15, 2008
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honestly, it seemed like he had something going on during the game. Something didn't seem right. It was almost like he was begging for a personal foul call a few times.

Plays I saw:

1) on the reverse by our receiver, LJ shoots across the field and hits the receiver (good solid hit) forcing the receiver out of bounds. Good play, except that our receiver (Ryan Wolfe) just got 12 yards and 1st down....that said it wasn't on LJ, he just came over and made the play....BUT, then he walks over the top of kneeling receiver, and after over him, he pushes his head down. Luckily Wolfe is the guy that speaks soft and carries a big stick...but totally uncalled for

2) The hit against Casey Flair, our other receiver. That one, I kinda understand and even the guys calling the game alluded to it. Flair is UNLV's leader in personal fouls and unsportsmanlike conduct penalties. He's the Jekyll to Ryan Wolfe's Hyde....Flair's super emotional and tries to get into people's head. If he wasn't on my team, I'd definitely not like him....but love him because he is. Flair, being from Alaska, has a chip on the shoulder...and UNLV fans are just excited that we've gone 4 games without an incident. That said, LJ should've found a more opportune time to get back at him. That was just a dumb penalty.

3) mind you, these 3 incidents were all on the same drive....the hit in the end zone....again, who's blocking LJ? Casey Flair...........but that hit was just flat out, a mindless, idiotic hit. There's still a line of sportsmanship in football, and hitting the starting QB of the other team 5 yards deep in the endzone, probably gets you tossed no matter what...even if he didn't have the other incidents that he did have.

....which brings me back to the original thought, what the heck was going on with this dude? One random, unconfirmed thought I had was that UNLV has 4 or 5 players from Cape Coral and Immokalee Florida, both about 2 hours from Clearwater, where LJ is from. Its possible there was a bit bantering between the two going back and forth, but who knows. I know Rodelin Anthony, one of our receivers from Florida, was doing a lot of downfield blocking...so its a possibility.....but who knows. The guy looked uncontrolled though if you watch this game again....its like he wasn't pulling any punches, he was blatantly taking his shots and letting the chips lie where they fell.

All this said, why would you even consider kicking him off the team for this one game? Young players sometimes make young player decisions. All this does is make you keep better tabs of him in the future, and put him on a shorter leash.
 
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jumbopackage

Well-Known Member
Sep 18, 2007
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honestly, it seemed like he had something going on during the game. Something didn't seem right. It was almost like he was begging for a personal foul call a few times.

Plays I saw:

1) on the reverse by our receiver, LJ shoots across the field and hits the receiver (good solid hit) forcing the receiver out of bounds. Good play, except that our receiver (Ryan Wolfe) just got 12 yards and 1st down....that said it wasn't on LJ, he just came over and made the play....BUT, then he walks over the top of kneeling receiver, and after over him, he pushes his head down. Luckily Wolfe is the guy that speaks soft and carries a big stick...but totally uncalled for

2) The hit against Casey Flair, our other receiver. That one, I kinda understand and even the guys calling the game alluded to it. Flair is UNLV's leader in personal fouls and unsportsmanlike conduct penalties. He's the Jekyll to Ryan Wolfe's Hyde....Flair's super emotional and tries to get into people's head. If he wasn't on my team, I'd definitely not like him....but love him because he is. Flair, being from Alaska, has a chip on the shoulder...and UNLV fans are just excited that we've gone 4 games without an incident. That said, LJ should've found a more opportune time to get back at him. That was just a dumb penalty.

3) mind you, these 3 incidents were all on the same drive....the hit in the end zone....again, who's blocking LJ? Casey Flair...........but that hit was just flat out, a mindless, idiotic hit. There's still a line of sportsmanship in football, and hitting the starting QB of the other team 5 yards deep in the endzone, probably gets you tossed no matter what...even if he didn't have the other incidents that he did have.

....which brings me back to the original thought, what the heck was going on with this dude? One random, unconfirmed thought I had was that UNLV has 4 or 5 players from Cape Coral and Immokalee Florida, both about 2 hours from Clearwater, where LJ is from. Its possible there was a bit bantering between the two going back and forth, but who knows. I know Rodelin Anthony, one of our receivers from Florida, was doing a lot of downfield blocking...so its a possibility.....but who knows. The guy looked uncontrolled though if you watch this game again....its like he wasn't pulling any punches, he was blatantly taking his shots and letting the chips lie where they fell.

All this said, why would you even consider kicking him off the team for this one game? Young players sometimes make young player decisions. All this does is make you keep better tabs of him in the future, and put him on a shorter leash.

Excellent post.

I don't think anyone is seriously advocating kicking him off the team. The concern is that he's averaging 1 PF a game so far this year, and a couple of them have come at REALLY bad times. He's young and has a ton of potential, but right now I think he's hurting the team as much, if not more, than he's helping. ISU's margin for error is very slim, and any sort of PF is really hard to overcome, especially when it keeps a drive alive.

I won't fault him for having a motor, and hitting hard (though I do wish he would actually tackle instead of trying to be a sportscenter highlight), but he's gotta keep it under control.

A few hundred pounds of controlled explosives can be just as, if not more, devastating than a nuclear weapon....
 

candg4ever

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Oct 29, 2006
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Nevada, IA
It's true that LJ is a superior athlete, but he needs to learn from his mistakes, something that just isn't happening right now. Sitting him for a game is not so much a punishment in my mind, but a time for him to reflect on his actions and how they affect him and his teammates negatively, and not just on the field. If we get a reputation as a team of head-hunters, word will get around and other teams may be inclined to reciprocate, then all hell breaks loose. Treat him as a young man who has made some mistakes and go from there.
 

cyclonenum1

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Nov 30, 2006
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For goodness sake...we are talking about playing football here...not chess. You have to have a certain mentality to be a great football player...especially on defense. One ex ISU football player put it this way "My whole body and soul are to be thrown recklessly about the field tomorrow." Does anyone know who said that?

I certainly don't condone "cheap shots"...unfortunately, I have not seen the play against the UNLV QB. However, I have seen the fumble causing play against Iowa and that my friends was a great stick...certainly not a cheap shot. Anyone that would consider that play against Iowa as a cheap shot is just plain wrong.
 
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CyAg

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May 22, 2006
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I do not think anyone is arguing the Iowa game penalty. It just happened on a fast play.

What is being discussed is the 2 penalties in one drive, the attitude shown, impact it has had and how many total we have.

Enthusiasm is not an excuse on a disciplined team for the errors.

Read todays paper, as is quoted, he will be facing punishment.

Personally, I feel let the coaches discipline him and see how he comes out after this.

However, 13 personal fouls in 4 games is something that needs to change fast.