For Cowboy fans chirping about the spot on their final play

cyrocksmypants

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Dec 29, 2008
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Just noting, the first down was at the 40 and the yellow line was a good 1/2+ yard short of the 40. Even with the pull I don't think he made it to the 40.
Yeah, the replay guy even specifically said don’t look at the yellow line because it’s wrong.
 

JD4560

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Did anyone else see that hold on Kolar at one point in the red zone in the second half? I thought it was blatantly obvious but I guess not.


Spots were also bad all day for both sides so they don't have a whole lot to moan about. He was short and the lineman pulling him forward should have been a flag as others have said.
 

cytor

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The spots were bad in the KState game as well.
 
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Pope

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Gundy admitted out loud during his post game press conference that their offensive lineman pulled the ball carrier to the line to gain, so it's ridiculous for Oklahoma State fans to complain about the spot. Poor babies.
 
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BCClone

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Uncatchable balls negate pass interference but have no bearing on defensive holding as far as I know. The ball doesn't even have to be passed for there to be defensive holding, just holding. It doesn't even have to be an eligible receiver that is being held. Sometimes they will call it on a defensive lineman who is holding an O lineman so that he can't get to the second level to block a linebacker.
The throw out of the back of the endzone negates things to my memory. The other option was the believe purdy was running and only threw the ball to avoid a loss.
 

tolfbfan

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There use to be a rule about assisting the runner. When I coached a 5th grade football team it cost us the win in an over time game. The kid who assisted wasn't even trying to assist he just got blown back from the line and ran straight forward which was the back of the qb who was actually carrying the ball for the win until the flag came out.
The recall booth didn't review it! Even midget teams get screwed if ISU related! WOW!:cool:
 
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TedKumsher

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That was ruled a dual-possession which they gave to OSU as an interception. Horrible call.
I was there.
If this is the play I'm thinking about -- it's even worse because the defender very clearly touched out of bounds well before he questionably "established" dual-possession.
 

TedKumsher

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Can anyone tell me why the defensive holding call flag was picked up in the third quarter? I watched the replay today and it seemed like a legit hold of Kolar. There had been two PI calls during that drive against OSU, so I guess the refs were reluctant to call a third penalty on the Cowboy defense in that one series?
I'm not saying this answers anything, especially since I haven't looked recently at a replay. Also, this is from 2018 and I don't know if there have been changes to the rules:
What Are the College Football Defensive Holding Rules? (sportsrec.com)

My best guess at the time wass that it was deemed legal due to being less than 5 yards downfield. Emphasis mine:
A defender cannot prevent a running back or receiver from advancing downfield beyond the blocking zone. A defender may jam the offensive player at the line of scrimmage, using legal hand movements, but must release them after five yards. A defender may not intentionally restrain an opponent from recovering a loose ball or fumble.​

Additionally, the refs might have thought Kolar was blocking the defender? Emphasis mine:

Defensive players may use hands and arms to push, pull, and ward off offensive players obviously attempting to block them.​

And finally, maybe they thought Kolar wasn't an eligible receiver:

If an offensive player is reported as an eligible receiver before the play, the defensive player must break contact with that player after five yards.​
 
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OnlyCyclones

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Are Cowboy fans chirping about their two missed field goals?
Pistols Firing Podcast, which was pretty reasonable in general I thought, really wanted Gundy to be more aggressive and go for it on both field goals. I’d agree with the 50 yarder especially.
 
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t-noah

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To counter OSU's argument on the spot at the end of the game, just point them to our first drive and the terrible spot on Purdy's 3rd down run, which would have kept that drive going.
I just watched it. Purdy was short, atleast by a foot. IMO.
 

JM4CY

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Pistols Firing Podcast, which was pretty reasonable in general I thought, really wanted Gundy to be more aggressive and go for it on both field goals. I’d agree with the 50 yarder especially.
I forgot about that one. I’ll give it a listen. Thanks for reminding me.
 

t-noah

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Okie Lite did that yesterday causing ISU to call a time out. Trotted on a lineman when they already had 11 players out there with no intention of a player coming off the field.
The official would not let us snap it until the Cowboys completed their half-hearted attempt at a substitution. Since the play clock was about to expire, that never happened. We were forced to call a timeout

I thought they had already run somebody off, but maybe my memory is wrong. Doesn't really matter, that big oaf never even made it to the defensive side of the ball.

H
yes.. but this is just a smart use of the rule by OSU. Def is allowed to sub. Net is, you can't make a late sub on offense or your at risk of having them pull this...

ISU has to get the right 11 on the field to start the play. Otherwise others will do this to us as well. In a close game, time outs are critical. You can't afford to use them like that.
When I watch the replay, what play should I focus on for this? Who has the ball? What play of what possession, what qtr.? I'm not sure I've ever noticed this before.
 

t-noah

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Maybe 10:43 left in the 2nd qtr.
It might have been there. Purdy took a time out. But the camera angles where too close to see what really happened. I'll look for it when I watch the replay closer.

Right around that time, the 8:03 mark of the 2nd qtr., might be a good example of how the refs were spotting it short. Here Hall looks like his down nearly at the 1st down line of gain; the ref spots it back a yard. Edit: Were they doing that (spotting it short) with both teams equally, or more so against ISU?
 

KidSilverhair

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The official would not let us snap it until the Cowboys completed their half-hearted attempt at a substitution. Since the play clock was about to expire, that never happened. We were forced to call a timeout

I thought they had already run somebody off, but maybe my memory is wrong. Doesn't really matter, that big oaf never even made it to the defensive side of the ball.

H
You know, this wouldn’t solve the issue - coaches like Gundy would respond by telling their substitution guys to walk in even slower - but I was thinking as I saw this happen that the official needs to let the offense snap the ball the instant the defensive substitute crosses the line of scrimmage. Or passes any other defensive player in the formation. If coaches want to play the angles of the rulefor an advantage, let them play basically 10 v 11 then.

That just crossed my mind as I saw that big lineman taking his leisurely stroll out there, stopping to check out an interesting worm on his way, just to force an ISU time out.

(And yes, the problem isn’t with the rule or clever coaches figuring out a way to game it, it’s with offensive coaches being way too late getting their packages/substitutes into the game)
 

heitclone

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I don't blame Okie St fans for being upset, the way the play got called looked wrong. The officials needed to call out the penalty for dragging the player forward. That would have taken care of any debate on the subject. That's how it should have been called. If there wasn't a penalty, it looked like he got the first down to me, he was clearly on top of his teammate. The end result was correct, it should have been ISU ball but the refs botched things by not making it correctly.
 

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