BYU wants in the Big 12

[drednot57]

Expansion is voluntary. That is why it is not happening.

Bottom line is that the Big 12 teams would make less money per team while not gaining much with expansion. That is why it will not happen. BYU has an inflated opinion of their program. PAC 12 did not even want them.

BYU is not in the Pac12 due to the conference not wishing to kowtow to BYU's demands, like they didn't kowtow to UT's demands of an independent TV network.

It's because the ten members of the Big12 Conference are satisfied with the current arrangement that expansion won't happen soon. As soon as something bad, or "unfair" happens due to being a ten team conference, the Big12 will look to expand.

 

[cykadelic2]

BYU is not in the Pac12 due to the conference not wishing to kowtow to BYU's demands, like they didn't kowtow to UT's demands of an independent TV network.

It's because the ten members of the Big12 Conference are satisfied with the current arrangement that expansion won't happen soon. As soon as something bad, or "unfair" happens due to being a ten team conference, the Big12 will look to expand.

BYUtv did have something to do with them not ending up in the Pac12 (as with the B12), but just as big of a factor was their LDS affiliation which didn't sit well with the significant liberal faction of P12, namely the two Northern CA schools.

 

[chuckd4735]

BYU is not in the Pac12 due to the conference not wishing to kowtow to BYU's demands, like they didn't kowtow to UT's demands of an independent TV network.

It's because the ten members of the Big12 Conference are satisfied with the current arrangement that expansion won't happen soon. As soon as something bad, or "unfair" happens due to being a ten team conference, the Big12 will look to expand.

What bad or unfair things will happen where the solution would be to add more players to the table to make decisions?

The more decision makers you add to the table, the less efficient things will become. As long as you have good leadership at the top, you will be fine.

 

[drednot57]

What bad or unfair things will happen where the solution would be to add more players to the table to make decisions?

The more decision makers you add to the table, the less efficient things will become. As long as you have good leadership at the top, you will be fine.

I'm thinking something like losing out on the CFB BCS playoff because a team winning its conference championship game is picked over the Big12 conference champion, although both teams may have one loss, or are undefeated. This scenario is certainly possible, and could steer the Big12 towards expanding back to 12 teams and two divisions. I'm not counting on that happening, but I'm certainly not counting it out either.

 

[jdoggivjc]

What bad or unfair things will happen where the solution would be to add more players to the table to make decisions?

The more decision makers you add to the table, the less efficient things will become. As long as you have good leadership at the top, you will be fine.

The "unfair thing" would be if the other conferences see that the Big 12 not having a championship game is an unfair advantage and limit entrants to the playoff to those that have won their conference championship game, and the NCAA refusing to change their stance that a conference must have a minimum of 12 teams to have a championship game. At that point the Big 12 will add two teams that they wouldn't necessarily add - such as a BYU or directional Florida or a similar school. Not until that point. That being said, I can't ever see the SEC allowing that becoming a requirement - not when some years potentially 3 of the 4 teams could come out of the SEC.

 

[CyFan61]

not when some years potentially 3 of the 4 teams could come out of the SEC.

I will eat my hat if a conference ever gets 3 teams into the 4-team playoff.

 

[cyrocksmypants]

I will eat my hat if a conference ever gets 3 teams into the 4-team playoff.

I second this. But I also want to note that I own a lot of fruit roll up hats.

 

[ISU42]

I second this. But I also want to note that I own a lot of fruit roll up hats.

I assume CyFan61 owns a Homer Simpson nacho hat.

 

[jdoggivjc]

I will eat my hat if a conference ever gets 3 teams into the 4-team playoff.

If (and only if) they use computers ala BCS to determine the playoff participants, the SEC could end up with multiple bids every year. Hell, a few years ago they had 3 of the top 4 or 5 teams in the BCS standings.

 

[colbycheese]

It seems to me that the teams that are available and that either make sense from a geographic standpoint, tv standpoint, recruiting standpoint, quality of athletic dept standpoint, or *gasp* academic standpoint are the following:

-BYU (TV mostly, quality of athletic department)
-Cincinatti (academics, university size, and TV - not a huge fanbase, but a big city market, geographic partner for WVU)
-UCONN (TV market, makes no sense geographically) (hope not, their fans are jerks)
-USF (TV, recruiting, university size)
-UCF (TV, recruiting, university size)
-Tulane (similar reasons to Cincinatti, great academics (AAU member), new stadium this year, plus recruiting, proximity to existing Big 12 footprint)

I really don't want any more Texas schools, and I really don't care if we stay at 10 or add one or two as long as long as ISU is making $$$!

Edit: PS, I really don't see any of those happening anytime soon, unless the Big 12 is required to have a championship game and 12 members. In that case, BYU, Cincy, or Tulane would by my top three choices.

 

[cykadelic2]

I'm thinking something like losing out on the CFB BCS playoff because a team winning its conference championship game is picked over the Big12 conference champion, although both teams may have one loss, or are undefeated. This scenario is certainly possible, and could steer the Big12 towards expanding back to 12 teams and two divisions. I'm not counting on that happening, but I'm certainly not counting it out either.

If you ever get into an argument with a SEC Ricky Bobby over whether or not their current scheduling format (8 games with CCG) or the B12's round-robin format is tougher, tell him to revert back to the original 10-team SEC and play a full 9-game round-robin schedule. Even a dip$hit Ricky Bobby would have to admit that 10-team round-robin SEC schedule would be a far more difficult schedule.

 

[drednot57]

If you ever get into an argument with a SEC Ricky Bobby over whether or not their current scheduling format (8 games with CCG) or the B12's round-robin format is tougher, tell him to revert back to the original 10-team SEC and play a full 9-game round-robin schedule. Even a dip$hit Ricky Bobby would have to admit that 10-team round-robin SEC schedule would be a far more difficult schedule.

I don't think its about a tougher schedule even though that sentiment is probably true. I think it may boil down to the CCG's being a defacto "first round" of the BCS championship tourney, along with the increased TV exposure a CCG brings to the other four conferences. A CCG keeps a conference "front and center" in people's minds for a longer period of time. The Big12 could lose out simply because the other power conferences are "fresher" in people's viewpoints, as the Big12's season would be ending before the CCGs are played. When it comes to the news cycle, people's memories are very short.

 

[CyFan61]

Reality is that he would leave ISU at the drop of a Big10 hat.

Quite frankly KU should feel that way. Same with K-State. And hell, if ISU had the chance to join the Big 10 tomorrow and passed, I would be severely disappointed with our leadership. We can't ignore what happened in 2010 and 2011 that almost relegated us out of "big boy" status. I would not enjoy the drop in football quality, but it's not like we've been winning 10 games a year in the Big 12 anyway. Meanwhile the added money and complete stability would be a huge boon. If the Big Ten somehow wanted Iowa State, we absolutely should accept. That said, I'm reasonably confident that the Big 12 will hold up for as long as it needs to, which is really until the whole conference model is eliminated when the major schools leave the NCAA, but that could be a decade or two away.

 

[CyFan61]

If (and only if) they use computers ala BCS to determine the playoff participants, the SEC could end up with multiple bids every year.

Which is why I said what I did... College football will never return to the days of computers making all the decisions. The committee format has worked well for NCAA basketball and I think will be successful for football, too.

 

[ianoconnor]

It seems to me that the teams that are available and that either make sense from a geographic standpoint, tv standpoint, recruiting standpoint, quality of athletic dept standpoint, or *gasp* academic standpoint are the following:

-BYU (TV mostly, quality of athletic department)
-Cincinatti (academics, university size, and TV - not a huge fanbase, but a big city market, geographic partner for WVU)
-UCONN (TV market, makes no sense geographically) (hope not, their fans are jerks)
-USF (TV, recruiting, university size)
-UCF (TV, recruiting, university size)
-Tulane (similar reasons to Cincinatti, great academics (AAU member), new stadium this year, plus recruiting, proximity to existing Big 12 footprint)

I really don't want any more Texas schools, and I really don't care if we stay at 10 or add one or two as long as long as ISU is making $$$!

Edit: PS, I really don't see any of those happening anytime soon, unless the Big 12 is required to have a championship game and 12 members. In that case, BYU, Cincy, or Tulane would by my top three choices.

Cincinnati*

:wink:

 

[SCarolinaCy]

When the time comes, UCF will be the choice. No Brainer.

 

[Rogue52]

I don't think its about a tougher schedule even though that sentiment is probably true. I think it may boil down to the CCG's being a defacto "first round" of the BCS championship tourney, along with the increased TV exposure a CCG brings to the other four conferences. A CCG keeps a conference "front and center" in people's minds for a longer period of time. The Big12 could lose out simply because the other power conferences are "fresher" in people's viewpoints, as the Big12's season would be ending before the CCGs are played. When it comes to the news cycle, people's memories are very short.

Unless something changes, the last week of the Big 12 regular season is conference championship weekend.

 

[CascadeClone]

The Big 12 will not expand. Why add more schools to the power 5 conferences. Before it is all said and done there will be 4 conferences with about the same number of teams in each of them. Makes for a nice neat system to get to the playoffs.

I think you are right on this. Eventually 4 super conferences with 16 each. Pac12, SEC, B1G and Big12. The Big12 stays small and strong for now, and then can be more easily combined with the ACC. There would be a few trades between all the conferences to help geography and even things out.

With a 16 team conference, you could play your 7 division opponents every year (can you say Big8?) and half the other division every year. And still have a non-con game vs whoever you like. Or two if they expand the schedule.

The playoffs, you have the division winners square off in conf champ games, then 4 conf champions in the "final four".

All that said, I think this is infinitely more probable (maybe even requires) the big FB conferences split from the NCAA. Then you'd have a small group of power brokers setting up the thing with enough juice to push schools around a bit.

The tricky part is there are like 65 power5 teams (counting ND), and this would make only space for 64. Not to mention all the others left on the outside- BYU, for example. I think ISU would be fine in this scenario.

 

[Judoka]

I don't think its about a tougher schedule even though that sentiment is probably true. I think it may boil down to the CCG's being a defacto "first round" of the BCS championship tourney, along with the increased TV exposure a CCG brings to the other four conferences. A CCG keeps a conference "front and center" in people's minds for a longer period of time. The Big12 could lose out simply because the other power conferences are "fresher" in people's viewpoints, as the Big12's season would be ending before the CCGs are played. When it comes to the news cycle, people's memories are very short.

The Big XII plays its last week of the season on the same weekend that other conferences play their championship games.