Arizona State Matchup

madguy30

Well-Known Member
Nov 15, 2011
54,661
51,987
113
Hey Iowa State fans,

I'm just a humble Sun Devil who is nervous about the game, stumbled in here, and excited to talk about this matchup. I'd love to provide a little context for you to understand ASU a little better, and I'd love it if you could share with me some important context for your own team! I'm active on the Sun Devil boards so I'll most definitely bring what I learn back to my fellow Sun Devils.

For the record, I believe this game will be very close and an absolute coin flip. Both teams have proven they have incredible grit, clutch playmakers, and both teams find ways to win when the going gets tough. Neither team gets shaken up. Both teams have excellent coaching. From a pure football standpoint - I think we're going to see some incredible football moments in this game.

A few questions I have for you guys...
  1. I've seen a lot of talk of your run defense being improved vs KSU. What are the reasons for that? Players returning from injury? Scheme changes? Obviously as an ASU fan, this is the matchup I'm most excited for.
  2. If ISU is able to slow Skat down significantly, who will the ISU players be that need to step up the most to make that happen?
  3. If you had to swap any players from ASU's team to your team, who would you swap and why? (Please...take our kicker.)
  4. A few days ago I looked into the average passing offense your team has faced, and it's 82nd in the nation. I believe this has contributed to your great pass defense rating, resulting in you being a bit overrated in that area. What do you believe I am missing?
  5. If you've been reading ASU perspectives, what do you think most ASU fans are getting wrong?

Three notes on Skattebo
  1. In ASU's offense Skattebo is often the target of screen passes or passes in to the flats. This means a great deal of his production is recorded as passing yards, not just rushing yards. However most analysis I'm seeing here is only talking about pure rushing numbers. Skattebo is currently #2 in the nation in yards per game from scrimmage (rushing + receiving yards.) #1 is Jeanty. Yards from scrimmage is a more appropriate way to measure Skat's production on this ASU offense as it captures his full impact, not just the times the ball is handed off to him. (He's currently ranked #8 nationally in touchdowns from scrimmage.)
  2. What makes Skattebo the best back in the Big 12 isn't just that he's #1 in the conference in ypg from scrimmage, but that he not only breaks tackles, but moves through tackles. Meaning if he's met in a gap by a defensive player in a short yardage situation, he's still extremely reliable in getting forward to that first down. It's very rare that someone stops him in his tracks unless they wrap his feet up. 34% of Skat's carries this season have resulted in a first down or a touchdown.
  3. It's my contention that Skat is absolutely the best back in the Big 12 and the best back ISU has faced all season. Nick Saban called him his "favorite college player to watch" for a reason. However he's not the "only good back" you've faced. I think he'll be the biggest handful for you, but it's not like your defense has been facing cupcake backs all season. If anyone isn't taking him seriously, the stats overwhelmingly say you should, and he's been playing his best football here in November with about a +30 ypg increase since early season. (Averaging 183.8 ypg in November.)
Two notes on Leavitt
  1. Important context on Leavitt is that he improved rapidly as a passer after the Texas Tech game. He had some footwork issues causing his accuracy to be pretty rough in the early season, but he's been putting it together and putting in some really brilliant performances for a RS freshman. Most importantly, his accuracy is extremely improved from early season and he takes care of the ball. Among the INTs he does have, few were bad decisions by him. Many were tipped balls.
  2. One other note on Leavitt - since Tyson's emergence, Leavitt has relied less on his legs. But early in the season ASU was winning games because of Skat and Leavitt's rushing yards. With Tyson now out, watch for Leavitt's legs to come in to play more.
A note on Tyson and the ASU Passing Game
  1. I'm willing to let anyone call this pure cope, but I try to to be as unbiased as I can with my team. Tyson being out absolutely hurts and anyone who acts like it doesn't is being a homer. But ASU is not without other threats at WR. I've seen a few ISU fans claim ASU is now a one dimensional offense without Tyson, but that's just not the case. During our best games, ASU had Tyson + Skattebo + Metayer to pass to, and given we run a lot as well, that's not a lot of touches left for guys like Stovall and Guillory. Stovall and Guillory can absolutely get behind a defense, and have on multiple occasions when they get the opportunity. They just don't get many of them. Hopefully the this kind of explains why ASU fans aren't in a full panic without Tyson. We're not one dimensional. We're definitely worse without him, though.

From what I've seen ASU has some real speed all over on offense and seems to be getting real traction lately. They'll be a problem.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: nrg4isu

nrg4isu

Well-Known Member
SuperFanatic
SuperFanatic T2
Dec 29, 2009
2,550
4,371
113
Springfield, Illinois
From what I've seen ASU has some real speed all over on offense and seems to be getting real traction lately. They'll be a problem.
Yep. Speed is what scares me the most. And is also why ASU losing Tyson is such a big deal.

We will start out (as always) in base defense and find out what our weaknesses are. I suspect Porter will be able to be on an island most of the night. It's amazing how well he's played all year. People don't notice because no one ever throws at the guy who he's covering.

If Tyson were in the game I'd expect a lot more trouble covering 1v1.

Levit seems to be the type of QB who can give us trouble. His strength is decision making. We excel in making QBs make bad decisions. That will be probably the biggest question mark of the game. Can we make him uncomfortable?

Skateboo is a problem without a doubt. But we'll do what our defense is designed to do. Limit damage. Our DBs are going to need to get off blocks all game. Linebackers need to run fit. I'm actually not super concerned. Even if Skateboo is the best back we've seen all season, we've already seen 4 of the top 10 in cfb. He'll get his, but I suspect we can limit the damage.

My biggest question mark is what is ASU like on defense? No one's talking about their defense. What do they do well? Who are their best players? Do they have a good pass rush?
 

SunDevil033

Member
Dec 4, 2024
20
35
13
From what I've seen ASU has some real speed all over on offense and seems to be getting real traction lately. They'll be a problem.
We've got speed, but the speed is regrettably not always reliable. USC WR transfer Jake Smith came to ASU and we were thrilled about the promise of his speed. Sure enough, he's gotten behind defenses, but despite some well thrown balls he just couldn't come up with a few catches that would have been sure touchdowns. Since then, he's gotten way fewer opportunities.

I think Guillory and Stovall are just good enough to stop you guys from loading the box all game, but not good enough that you guys won't blitz from time to time and trust your DBs in man. Just my hunch.
 

RagingCloner

Well-Known Member
Dec 2, 2022
3,948
5,832
113
Yep. Speed is what scares me the most. And is also why ASU losing Tyson is such a big deal.

We will start out (as always) in base defense and find out what our weaknesses are. I suspect Porter will be able to be on an island most of the night. It's amazing how well he's played all year. People don't notice because no one ever throws at the guy who he's covering.

If Tyson were in the game I'd expect a lot more trouble covering 1v1.

Levit seems to be the type of QB who can give us trouble. His strength is decision making. We excel in making QBs make bad decisions. That will be probably the biggest question mark of the game. Can we make him uncomfortable?

Skateboo is a problem without a doubt. But we'll do what our defense is designed to do. Limit damage. Our DBs are going to need to get off blocks all game. Linebackers need to run fit. I'm actually not super concerned. Even if Skateboo is the best back we've seen all season, we've already seen 4 of the top 10 in cfb. He'll get his, but I suspect we can limit the damage.

My biggest question mark is what is ASU like on defense? No one's talking about their defense. What do they do well? Who are their best players? Do they have a good pass rush?
Their D line is very mediocore, and their secondary is tied with ISU for interceptions this year.

Rocco will have time, and needs to not rush his throws
 

RagingCloner

Well-Known Member
Dec 2, 2022
3,948
5,832
113
Hey Iowa State fans,

I'm just a humble Sun Devil who is nervous about the game, stumbled in here, and excited to talk about this matchup. I'd love to provide a little context for you to understand ASU a little better, and I'd love it if you could share with me some important context for your own team! I'm active on the Sun Devil boards so I'll most definitely bring what I learn back to my fellow Sun Devils.

For the record, I believe this game will be very close and an absolute coin flip. Both teams have proven they have incredible grit, clutch playmakers, and both teams find ways to win when the going gets tough. Neither team gets shaken up. Both teams have excellent coaching. From a pure football standpoint - I think we're going to see some incredible football moments in this game.

A few questions I have for you guys...
  1. I've seen a lot of talk of your run defense being improved vs KSU. What are the reasons for that? Players returning from injury? Scheme changes? Obviously as an ASU fan, this is the matchup I'm most excited for.
  2. If ISU is able to slow Skat down significantly, who will the ISU players be that need to step up the most to make that happen?
  3. If you had to swap any players from ASU's team to your team, who would you swap and why? (Please...take our kicker.)
  4. A few days ago I looked into the average passing offense your team has faced, and it's 82nd in the nation. I believe this has contributed to your great pass defense rating, resulting in you being a bit overrated in that area. What do you believe I am missing?
  5. If you've been reading ASU perspectives, what do you think most ASU fans are getting wrong?

Three notes on Skattebo
  1. In ASU's offense Skattebo is often the target of screen passes or passes in to the flats. This means a great deal of his production is recorded as passing yards, not just rushing yards. However most analysis I'm seeing here is only talking about pure rushing numbers. Skattebo is currently #2 in the nation in yards per game from scrimmage (rushing + receiving yards.) #1 is Jeanty. Yards from scrimmage is a more appropriate way to measure Skat's production on this ASU offense as it captures his full impact, not just the times the ball is handed off to him. (He's currently ranked #8 nationally in touchdowns from scrimmage.)
  2. What makes Skattebo the best back in the Big 12 isn't just that he's #1 in the conference in ypg from scrimmage, but that he not only breaks tackles, but moves through tackles. Meaning if he's met in a gap by a defensive player in a short yardage situation, he's still extremely reliable in getting forward to that first down. It's very rare that someone stops him in his tracks unless they wrap his feet up. 34% of Skat's carries this season have resulted in a first down or a touchdown.
  3. It's my contention that Skat is absolutely the best back in the Big 12 and the best back ISU has faced all season. Nick Saban called him his "favorite college player to watch" for a reason. However he's not the "only good back" you've faced. I think he'll be the biggest handful for you, but it's not like your defense has been facing cupcake backs all season. If anyone isn't taking him seriously, the stats overwhelmingly say you should, and he's been playing his best football here in November with about a +30 ypg increase since early season. (Averaging 183.8 ypg in November.)
Two notes on Leavitt
  1. Important context on Leavitt is that he improved rapidly as a passer after the Texas Tech game. He had some footwork issues causing his accuracy to be pretty rough in the early season, but he's been putting it together and putting in some really brilliant performances for a RS freshman. Most importantly, his accuracy is extremely improved from early season and he takes care of the ball. Among the INTs he does have, few were bad decisions by him. Many were tipped balls.
  2. One other note on Leavitt - since Tyson's emergence, Leavitt has relied less on his legs. But early in the season ASU was winning games because of Skat and Leavitt's rushing yards. With Tyson now out, watch for Leavitt's legs to come in to play more.
A note on Tyson and the ASU Passing Game
  1. I'm willing to let anyone call this pure cope, but I try to to be as unbiased as I can with my team. Tyson being out absolutely hurts and anyone who acts like it doesn't is being a homer. But ASU is not without other threats at WR. I've seen a few ISU fans claim ASU is now a one dimensional offense without Tyson, but that's just not the case. During our best games, ASU had Tyson + Skattebo + Metayer to pass to, and given we run a lot as well, that's not a lot of touches left for guys like Stovall and Guillory. Stovall and Guillory can absolutely get behind a defense, and have on multiple occasions when they get the opportunity. They just don't get many of them. Hopefully the this kind of explains why ASU fans aren't in a full panic without Tyson. We're not one dimensional. We're definitely worse without him, though.
Welcome, please bring more of your ASU friends over. Really we welcome anyone but Iowa fans and Ute fans.

The ISU DC is notorious for taking away offensive options, and has done so on many occasions, almost every game in fact. Tyson being out makes his job that much easier IMO. I dont believe Skattebo can be stopped, but he will be contained. This defense is the same thing that Cinci runs, however ISU just does it better, as they have been doing it for longer

I think it will be a good matchup, and i like Dillingham a lot. I think he has the ASU program in a great spot. I could see either team winning this game, however i think ISU has a better chance with Tyson being out.

Good luck, and as always, F**k OuT and horns down
 

dosry5

Well-Known Member
Nov 28, 2006
7,436
6,393
113
Johnston
Hey Iowa State fans,

I'm just a humble Sun Devil who is nervous about the game, stumbled in here, and excited to talk about this matchup. I'd love to provide a little context for you to understand ASU a little better, and I'd love it if you could share with me some important context for your own team! I'm active on the Sun Devil boards so I'll most definitely bring what I learn back to my fellow Sun Devils.

For the record, I believe this game will be very close and an absolute coin flip. Both teams have proven they have incredible grit, clutch playmakers, and both teams find ways to win when the going gets tough. Neither team gets shaken up. Both teams have excellent coaching. From a pure football standpoint - I think we're going to see some incredible football moments in this game.

A few questions I have for you guys...
  1. I've seen a lot of talk of your run defense being improved vs KSU. What are the reasons for that? Players returning from injury? Scheme changes? Obviously as an ASU fan, this is the matchup I'm most excited for.
  2. If ISU is able to slow Skat down significantly, who will the ISU players be that need to step up the most to make that happen?
  3. If you had to swap any players from ASU's team to your team, who would you swap and why? (Please...take our kicker.)
  4. A few days ago I looked into the average passing offense your team has faced, and it's 82nd in the nation. I believe this has contributed to your great pass defense rating, resulting in you being a bit overrated in that area. What do you believe I am missing?
  5. If you've been reading ASU perspectives, what do you think most ASU fans are getting wrong?

Three notes on Skattebo
  1. In ASU's offense Skattebo is often the target of screen passes or passes in to the flats. This means a great deal of his production is recorded as passing yards, not just rushing yards. However most analysis I'm seeing here is only talking about pure rushing numbers. Skattebo is currently #2 in the nation in yards per game from scrimmage (rushing + receiving yards.) #1 is Jeanty. Yards from scrimmage is a more appropriate way to measure Skat's production on this ASU offense as it captures his full impact, not just the times the ball is handed off to him. (He's currently ranked #8 nationally in touchdowns from scrimmage.)
  2. What makes Skattebo the best back in the Big 12 isn't just that he's #1 in the conference in ypg from scrimmage, but that he not only breaks tackles, but moves through tackles. Meaning if he's met in a gap by a defensive player in a short yardage situation, he's still extremely reliable in getting forward to that first down. It's very rare that someone stops him in his tracks unless they wrap his feet up. 34% of Skat's carries this season have resulted in a first down or a touchdown.
  3. It's my contention that Skat is absolutely the best back in the Big 12 and the best back ISU has faced all season. Nick Saban called him his "favorite college player to watch" for a reason. However he's not the "only good back" you've faced. I think he'll be the biggest handful for you, but it's not like your defense has been facing cupcake backs all season. If anyone isn't taking him seriously, the stats overwhelmingly say you should, and he's been playing his best football here in November with about a +30 ypg increase since early season. (Averaging 183.8 ypg in November.)
Two notes on Leavitt
  1. Important context on Leavitt is that he improved rapidly as a passer after the Texas Tech game. He had some footwork issues causing his accuracy to be pretty rough in the early season, but he's been putting it together and putting in some really brilliant performances for a RS freshman. Most importantly, his accuracy is extremely improved from early season and he takes care of the ball. Among the INTs he does have, few were bad decisions by him. Many were tipped balls.
  2. One other note on Leavitt - since Tyson's emergence, Leavitt has relied less on his legs. But early in the season ASU was winning games because of Skat and Leavitt's rushing yards. With Tyson now out, watch for Leavitt's legs to come in to play more.
A note on Tyson and the ASU Passing Game
  1. I'm willing to let anyone call this pure cope, but I try to to be as unbiased as I can with my team. Tyson being out absolutely hurts and anyone who acts like it doesn't is being a homer. But ASU is not without other threats at WR. I've seen a few ISU fans claim ASU is now a one dimensional offense without Tyson, but that's just not the case. During our best games, ASU had Tyson + Skattebo + Metayer to pass to, and given we run a lot as well, that's not a lot of touches left for guys like Stovall and Guillory. Stovall and Guillory can absolutely get behind a defense, and have on multiple occasions when they get the opportunity. They just don't get many of them. Hopefully the this kind of explains why ASU fans aren't in a full panic without Tyson. We're not one dimensional. We're definitely worse without him, though.
Nice try Coach Dilingham….do your own scouting!
 

nrg4isu

Well-Known Member
SuperFanatic
SuperFanatic T2
Dec 29, 2009
2,550
4,371
113
Springfield, Illinois
Welcome, please bring more of your ASU friends over. Really we welcome anyone but Iowa fans and Ute fans.

The ISU DC is notorious for taking away offensive options, and has done so on many occasions, almost every game in fact. Tyson being out makes his job that much easier IMO. I dont believe Skattebo can be stopped, but he will be contained. This defense is the same thing that Cinci runs, however ISU just does it better, as they have been doing it for longer. It did appear that 3-3-5 D did give Leavitt and the offense fits when they played UC.

I think it will be a good matchup, and i like Dillingham a lot. I think he has the ASU program in a great spot. I could see either team winning this game, however i think ISU has a better chance with Tyson being out.

Good luck, and as always, F**k OuT and horns down
Levit didn't play against Cincy
 

SunDevil033

Member
Dec 4, 2024
20
35
13
My biggest question mark is what is ASU like on defense? No one's talking about their defense. What do they do well? Who are their best players? Do they have a good pass rush?
Does well:
  • Opportunistic and very good at taking advantage of offensive mistakes. These guys have been very high-motor and they make up for lack of raw talent sometimes with pure effort. Swarms to the ball.
  • Run defense has been excellent. We've played a lot of the same backs as you guys but have maintained a top-25 rush defense.
  • Well coached. The safeties are the strongest position group and they are excellent. Offenses rarely go over the top of this defense. Instead, they have to move through it.
Weaknesses:
  • Pass rush. Plain and simple, we just don't get to the QB very well unless we bring pressure. A 4 man rush won't do it with this group against good o-lines.
  • Some of our zone looks get picked apart and we end up giving up chunks of intermediate yards. See the KSU and BYU comebacks after we went up by 21 points on each.
  • 3rd down pass defense is insanely frustrating. I'm at point where if I see a team at 3rd and 15 I don't just assume we're fine.
Best players:
  • Rowser and Alford (safeties) are leading tacklers who fly around the field and often make plays behind the line of scrimmage.
  • Linebacker has been very reliable - McCullough and Elliot are both playmakers. McCullough has got two INTs on the season at LB.
I think you guys are absolutely going to have moments where you really eat in the passing game. I'm hopeful our secondary can just make enough plays.
 
  • Like
Reactions: nrg4isu

nrg4isu

Well-Known Member
SuperFanatic
SuperFanatic T2
Dec 29, 2009
2,550
4,371
113
Springfield, Illinois
Another thing that i find interesting is how the past few games have played out for ASU. Both against KState and BYU, ASU has built up pretty sizable leads only to have to hold on at the end. Iowa state conversely has spent a lot of the year playing from behind. Clearly we've been comfortable doing that and successful at completing the comebacks.

Personally I hope that's not how this game goes.
 
  • Like
Reactions: RagingCloner

Cyforce

Well-Known Member
Nov 24, 2009
16,743
12,740
113
Des Moines
Their #2 WR has 17 receptions on the year. Gotta believe are safeties will be walked up to stop the run.
 
Nov 13, 2024
46
42
18
Not sure where to go to get this data, but where do the other receivers for ASU stand in receptions vs. targets?
Are the other WR not targeted as much because of chemistry with Tyson or is their reception:target percentage lower so doesn’t throw to them?
If the former then I could see where the next man up mentality could surprise us. If the latter then we may be able to exploit this and debit more attention to stopping scat.
 

stateofmind

Well-Known Member
Jul 16, 2007
6,585
4,101
113
Ankeny
I'm still trying to figure out why ASU was picked last. How is it possible everyone missed that this would be the best team?

Dillingham is a lot like CMC and like 10 years younger. We showed promise last year and returned almost everyone. So you have to think the law of averages alone would be that we should be the better team. I guess it's just the injury bug, which ASU had a major one hit last week. Hopefully Verdon is healthy but I really liked what we saw from James this past week. Would love to see Brehmer back, but Burkle is looking like we hoped we'd see from him.

The narrative of this game from the talking heads will be so predictable. If it's a good, close game, they will say neither deserves a shot. If either wins easily it will be, see how easy the XII is to win. I can't figure a scenario where people come away impressed with our league and that's a shame.

Anyway I'll be in the stadium and I can't wait.
 

SunDevil033

Member
Dec 4, 2024
20
35
13
Not sure where to go to get this data, but where do the other receivers for ASU stand in receptions vs. targets?
Are the other WR not targeted as much because of chemistry with Tyson or is their reception:target percentage lower so doesn’t throw to them?
If the former then I could see where the next man up mentality could surprise us. If the latter then we may be able to exploit this and debit more attention to stopping scat.
PFF has good data on it. It's a little bit of both. Tyson was sharing targets with Guillory until about the Texas Tech game when he began really bonding with Leavitt. That cut down on Guillory's targets. Then you've got Metayer and Skat taking a ton of the other snaps, and obviously we're going to run the ball a lot. Stovall and Smith just haven't gotten a lot of targets, just not enough to go around. Not saying they are elite, but they don't necessarily suck. (Stovall's PFF grade is similar to your #3 WR Brown.)

There's also the completely legit argument that if a WR was really that good they'd earn snaps. But obviously what we had going was good for 10 wins. So *shrug*.

With that said though, you should definitely expect ASU to heavily include both Skat and Kyson Brown (#2 RB) in this game plan, including passes. Both are among our best receivers.

Fun fact: Skat actually pops out in to the slot or wide about 15% of his passing targets. I'm curious to see if they do that more to get creative with the play calling while Tyson is out.