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VeloClone

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Jan 19, 2010
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The key is when might we expect a vaccine. If we actually get a vaccine by next spring I think people would be more willing to make sacrifices now. I don’t think there is widespread confidence in getting that. I think that is where a lot of the push to reopen comes from. I think there are a lot of people who see the let’s not do this or that people would advocate for that indefinitely even if we don’t get a vaccine by next spring.

I think people have to realize the perspective others are coming from. If someone isn’t confident in getting a vaccine in the foreseeable future it makes sense that they wouldn’t want to stay shut down. If someone thinks a vaccine is in the near future it makes sense that they would say let’s just wait until then.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/science/coronavirus-vaccine-tracker.html

With over 140 vaccines currently being tested and fast tracked I think that the chances are good that one or more that is safe and helps even marginally will come out of it. We may not end up with the ultimate vaccine solution right away but it may be something that still saves thousands of lives worldwide. We don't know but I believe a good possibility to save many lives is worth the sacrifice of a single season of going to football games and the hassle of wearing a face mask.
 

Cyclad

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Apr 12, 2006
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And without looking at the map, I can just about tell you on which political side they lean.
Masks are one of the most effective things we currently have. They should be required. Glad some states are concerned enough about the health of their people to require them.
BTW - How is your hot weather plan working out?
Hint - ask Arizona.
 
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Urbandale2013

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https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/science/coronavirus-vaccine-tracker.html

With over 140 vaccines currently being tested and fast tracked I think that the chances are good that one or more that is safe and helps even marginally will come out of it. We may not end up with the ultimate vaccine solution right away but it may be something that still saves thousands of lives worldwide. We don't know but I believe a good possibility to save many lives is worth the sacrifice of a single season of going to football games and the hassle of wearing a face mask.
Thats fine and all but you also have to be understanding of someone who doesn’t have your optimism. They don’t want to needlessly kill people for football. They just don’t necessarily think we will be able to be back to normal next year.

I know for me I’d put a successful vaccine in the spring at about 50%. I’d also put the odds of not having a vaccine 5 years from now at maybe 25%. If you could guarantee we would be back to normal by the spring then I’d be fine cancelling football this year or trying with no fans. That’s not the case so I want to try to get fans in if we can. Don’t risk to much but allow people to make some of their own calculations.

I still can understand your perspective. I may not fully agree with it but I can understand where you come from. I hope you can understand how someone like me can come to my perspective and stance.
 

cycloneG

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Thats fine and all but you also have to be understanding of someone who doesn’t have your optimism. They don’t want to needlessly kill people for football. They just don’t necessarily think we will be able to be back to normal next year.

I know for me I’d put a successful vaccine in the spring at about 50%. I’d also put the odds of not having a vaccine 5 years from now at maybe 25%. If you could guarantee we would be back to normal by the spring then I’d be fine cancelling football this year or trying with no fans. That’s not the case so I want to try to get fans in if we can. Don’t risk to much but allow people to make some of their own calculations.

I still can understand your perspective. I may not fully agree with it but I can understand where you come from. I hope you can understand how someone like me can come to my perspective and stance.

This Coronavirus Doesn't Change Quickly, And That's Good News For Vaccine Makers

https://www.npr.org/sections/health...uickly-and-thats-good-news-for-vaccine-makers
 
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FOREVERTRUE

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This Coronavirus Doesn't Change Quickly, And That's Good News For Vaccine Makers

https://www.npr.org/sections/health...uickly-and-thats-good-news-for-vaccine-makers


That is all good news, but even this article alludes to the fact mass vaccination attempts are still a long ways off. "That will take months, she says, in addition to the months required to develop a vaccine in the first place." So there is still a good chance that it won't be widely available in a years time, which is my concern.
 

cycloneG

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That is all good news, but even this article alludes to the fact mass vaccination attempts are still a long ways off. "That will take months, she says, in addition to the months required to develop a vaccine in the first place." So there is still a good chance that it won't be widely available in a years time, which is my concern.

Everyone wearing a mask and washing their hands would go a long way to a return to normal. A virus that doesn't mutate much is a positive for the long-term return to normal.
 

VeloClone

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Thats fine and all but you also have to be understanding of someone who doesn’t have your optimism. They don’t want to needlessly kill people for football. They just don’t necessarily think we will be able to be back to normal next year.

I know for me I’d put a successful vaccine in the spring at about 50%. I’d also put the odds of not having a vaccine 5 years from now at maybe 25%. If you could guarantee we would be back to normal by the spring then I’d be fine cancelling football this year or trying with no fans. That’s not the case so I want to try to get fans in if we can. Don’t risk to much but allow people to make some of their own calculations.

I still can understand your perspective. I may not fully agree with it but I can understand where you come from. I hope you can understand how someone like me can come to my perspective and stance.
I somewhat understand the perspective. But what I don't understand is why the football season is so important that without a guarantee so many people are willing to let people needlessly suffer and die instead of at least giving the vaccine makers a chance to make it happen. If I get cancer and they have a therapy that is 50% effective but the cost is I won't be able to go to a few events this year, I'm pretty sure I am signing up for it. But if they can't guarantee it will work many people instead just choose to die?

If the football season is cancelled or the opportunity to attend in person is cancelled that doesn't mean that football will never happen until there is a vaccine. There will be the opportunity to reassess next year, and the next, and so on. You seem to be stuck on the premise that if we cancel this year we are stuck with no football or no going to games until COVID is no longer a threat. That isn't the case at all.
 

CYEATHAWK

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Aug 26, 2007
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Requiring masks until an effective vaccine is available seems reasonable.

Is wearing them the rest of your life then reasonable? Look up antigenic drift/shift. There has never been an "effective" vaccine developed against virals with those abilities.
 

VeloClone

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That is all good news, but even this article alludes to the fact mass vaccination attempts are still a long ways off. "That will take months, she says, in addition to the months required to develop a vaccine in the first place." So there is still a good chance that it won't be widely available in a years time, which is my concern.
It is a concern to everyone. But allowing fans in Jack Trice Stadium this fall is not going to speed up that timeline. It could very well speed up the rate of infection and the death rate though.

And just because mass vaccination is not ready doesn't mean that the ability to vaccinate the most vulnerable won't be available. People keep pointing to the overwhelming majority of deaths among the elderly and those with pre-existing conditions. If we are able to start a reasonable amount of vaccination in that population the threat of COVID is drastically reduced.
 

cycloneG

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Is wearing them the rest of your life then reasonable? Look up antigenic drift/shift. There has never been an "effective" vaccine developed against virals with those abilities.

I don't believe the amount of resources currently being used to develop a vaccine has ever happened before.
 

Urbandale2013

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I somewhat understand the perspective. But what I don't understand is why the football season is so important that without a guarantee so many people are willing to let people needlessly suffer and die instead of at least giving the vaccine makers a chance to make it happen. If I get cancer and they have a therapy that is 50% effective but the cost is I won't be able to go to a few events this year, I'm pretty sure I am signing up for it. But if they can't guarantee it will work many people instead just choose to die?

If the football season is cancelled or the opportunity to attend in person is cancelled that doesn't mean that football will never happen until there is a vaccine. There will be the opportunity to reassess next year, and the next, and so on. You seem to be stuck on the premise that if we cancel this year we are stuck with no football or no going to games until COVID is no longer a threat. That isn't the case at all.
Sports are one of the main things in my life. The other being friends. I have now gone over 3 months without either. We also didn’t do a ton as friends during basketball season because frankly none of us wanted to watch games and that’s a big thing we do together.

I’m planning on hopefully seeing friends next weekend for the first time but we are still trying to limit what we do. If they cancel football I absolutely do not expect basketball. So cancelling football means a year with no sports.

You can also combine those cancellations with a few of the other things I do throughout the year. The fair and 4th of July festivities were cancelled. So the reality is I will be going an entire calendar year where all I do is work frankly. I want to work to live not live to work.

My mental health is stable for now but I don’t know where it would be without anything for the next 9 months. I don’t think your analogy is totally right. I’d say it is closer to taking chemo which has a 50% chance of healing cancer I may not even have.
 

ISUCyclones2015

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If we are at a point to have a season and other Big 12 schools aren’t we would join up with another conference or something.

Hope you enjoy playing MAC schools for a full season. No chance a conference would swap us in.

The only way a season happens is if we get lucky and have a vaccine in late 2020 like Fauci is hoping and then to attend a game you must have been vaccinated. "Immunity passports" will absolutely be a thing for 2021 all over the world.
 

VeloClone

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Jan 19, 2010
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Sports are one of the main things in my life. The other being friends. I have now gone over 3 months without either. We also didn’t do a ton as friends during basketball season because frankly none of us wanted to watch games and that’s a big thing we do together.

I’m planning on hopefully seeing friends next weekend for the first time but we are still trying to limit what we do. If they cancel football I absolutely do not expect basketball. So cancelling football means a year with no sports.

You can also combine those cancellations with a few of the other things I do throughout the year. The fair and 4th of July festivities were cancelled. So the reality is I will be going an entire calendar year where all I do is work frankly. I want to work to live not live to work.

My mental health is stable for now but I don’t know where it would be without anything for the next 9 months. I don’t think your analogy is totally right. I’d say it is closer to taking chemo which has a 50% chance of healing cancer I may not even have.
That is the problem that so many people are failing to see or don't care enough to see. It's not all about you.

Also, MLB, MLS, NBA and WNBA at the very least are starting play. You may not be able to attend these games at this time but it won't be "a year with no sports".
 

Gunnerclone

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Jul 16, 2010
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Sports are one of the main things in my life. The other being friends. I have now gone over 3 months without either. We also didn’t do a ton as friends during basketball season because frankly none of us wanted to watch games and that’s a big thing we do together.

I’m planning on hopefully seeing friends next weekend for the first time but we are still trying to limit what we do. If they cancel football I absolutely do not expect basketball. So cancelling football means a year with no sports.

You can also combine those cancellations with a few of the other things I do throughout the year. The fair and 4th of July festivities were cancelled. So the reality is I will be going an entire calendar year where all I do is work frankly. I want to work to live not live to work.

My mental health is stable for now but I don’t know where it would be without anything for the next 9 months. I don’t think your analogy is totally right. I’d say it is closer to taking chemo which has a 50% chance of healing cancer I may not even have.

Ts & Ps. Hopefully you’ve at least been able to get in at Great Clips.
 

GrappleCy

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Aug 7, 2018
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Eventually everyone will get COVID. That is possibly true. But there are a lot of promising vaccine candidates being tested right now. We may end up in a situation - a lot like the way we handle the flu which keeps getting brought up - where many people, especially those with pre-existing conditions, get a periodic vaccine to limit their chances of getting and reduce the severity of infection. While this is all difficult, I don't think taking measures to limit the spread while we give the vaccines time to be tested is too high of a price to pay for saving lives of many who a vulnerable and a few that have no pre-existing condition. In my mind the loss of the ability to attend one season of football games isn't even in the conversation of prices too high to pay. Neither is covering my face when out in public.

My octogenarian mother and septuagenarian in-laws probably agree.

Also even if a vaccine doesn't come through in the short term the longer this goes the more we learn about the disease and how to treat it. I'd rather get it today than in March, and I'm sure I'd rather get it in December than now. Just like masks don't have to be 100% effective to be worthwhile for everyone to wear, changes in treatment that improve outcomes but don't 100% deal with the virus are still worthwhile.
 

madguy30

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Nov 15, 2011
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Sports are one of the main things in my life. The other being friends. I have now gone over 3 months without either. We also didn’t do a ton as friends during basketball season because frankly none of us wanted to watch games and that’s a big thing we do together.

I’m planning on hopefully seeing friends next weekend for the first time but we are still trying to limit what we do. If they cancel football I absolutely do not expect basketball. So cancelling football means a year with no sports.

You can also combine those cancellations with a few of the other things I do throughout the year. The fair and 4th of July festivities were cancelled. So the reality is I will be going an entire calendar year where all I do is work frankly. I want to work to live not live to work.

My mental health is stable for now but I don’t know where it would be without anything for the next 9 months. I don’t think your analogy is totally right. I’d say it is closer to taking chemo which has a 50% chance of healing cancer I may not even have.

It's summer.

Find other things to do than sports and festivals. Other things do exist.