San Francisco declared a city wide emergency before they even had one single case of coronavirus.
California has been a lot more proactive than Iowa has. And Illinois has too obviously.
Coronavirus Coronavirus: In-Iowa General Discussion (Not Limited)
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San Francisco declared a city wide emergency before they even had one single case of coronavirus.
California has been a lot more proactive than Iowa has. And Illinois has too obviously.
SF had a citywide emergency before any of this started.
While I want Iowa to be proactive, when you have dense and populous cities like San Fran, LA, and Chicago, your need to be proactive is magnified much more.
How long should we isolate everyone though? Every medical expert that says we need to shut everything down gives no timeline for how long that needs to go on. They have a one track mind where they are focused on one thing, the virus. If things stay shut down for too long, we could be looking at a full blown economic depression. That has to be taken into account when making decisions about how many businesses to shut down, and for how long.
If you want to see real economic depression let COVID-19 tear through some of the huge manufacturers in this country and totally screw up everything in the supply chain.
Economic depression at this point is virtually a guarantee.
It's better to leave shutting down with an open time period than tell everyone a time period you can't live up to. If your prescribed shut down doesn't take care of everything you just blew all of your credibility.
This just defies common sense.
Do you really think there's no information available about how long this might last? Like, no experts who've talked extensively on the record about it? Or reporters writing about it?
Do you really think medical experts have no concept of how damaging their recommendations are to the global economy?
Do you really think political leaders are so blindly following orders of medical experts that they are willing to put millions of people out of work for no good reason?
But here's the most important one: what exactly do you think would have happened to the economy if we had done what many on this web site wanted, which was absolutely nothing? Do you believe the economy continues on without disruption?
It's going to be difficult. A lot of the decision making process will obviously depend on how things go in containing the virus, or perhaps how the public at large perceives it.
I think it's possible that officials get the positive turn of events they need and the public interprets it as a green light to start returning things to normal a week or two too soon.
If/when some form of positive turn begins, the message will need to be carefully worded and given. Positive news and outcomes will be most welcome and should be, but there would need to be a very finely tuned connection to being patient and waiting it out for another 2-3 weeks or whatever is seemingly needed.
Most experts are saying this will last 12-18 months. We can't stay at this level of shut down, much less a more strict level, for 12-18 months.
I agree the economy was doomed no matter what we did. I don't think it's a no brainer to keep increasing restrictions. It at least merits a discussion and some consideration for the economic impact. There is no blue print for how to handle this crises, so I don't like when people suggest we need to "shut everything down" at all costs. That isn't reasonable. I think for a long-term plan, it's realistic to keep restricting large groups (50+) and have people work from home as much as possible. Basically no festivals, no sporting events, no church services, no theme parks, restricted movies, etc.... I don't think it's reasonable to keep restaurants, bars and other "non-essential" business closed for longer than 2-3 weeks, MAYBE a month. That's fine for a very short-term plan to hopefully give the our healthcare industry time to "catch up". In the long-term we'll need extensive testing and probably have everyone wear masks out in public. Outside of that, life will have to continue in a fairly normal fashion, regardless of what the virus id doing. That's just one man's opinion.
People are much more likely to obey restrictions if they have a time line for when it will end. It's like a diet. Most diets don't work long-term because there is no light at the end of the tunnel. People can push through for a limited amount of time if they know there is an end date. That is my fear of not having any type of end date planned. I don't think the population will adhere to a strict "shelter in place" policy with no timeline in place for very long, regardless of what the government demands.
I can see a busy road from the back of my house. I am shocked at how many people are out today.
I don't know yet how it will work, but there will have to be some standard set for a rolling return to normalcy, based on CDC metrics for a given area. It can't be set at a fixed point in time, because if you miss it you damage the public trust which encourages people to dismiss other edicts.
I can see air travel locked down more or less for a long time, though.
So even with our efforts isolate, we've now got two kids with a cough and one of them now has a fever. Probably not Corvid-19 since I don't know where they got it. But we're being extra critical about any sort of cough.
Obviously with the testing situation we're just treating it like any cold or flu. But the household is now on full quarantine. Basically already were, but now avoiding the grocery atore.
Obviously with the testing situation we're just treating it like any cold or flu. But the household is now on full quarantine. Basically already were, but now avoiding the grocery atore.
You need to be careful here though with an older rural population and a rural healthcare system that can’t absorb this.
I pray everyone gets well in your home. And everyone's home.
They’ll probably tell you the same thing wrt testing, but make sure you’ve let your provider know
Watch their fevers and force the fluids of course. And these are available if you are on the fence about needing some answers or not:
https://www.mylabbox.com/product/home-flu-test/
It's easy for those of you that dont work an in essential service industry, own a small business, or work in a service driven industry that rely on being open to earn a wage to sit there and say just shut everything down indefinitely. Try putting yourself in the shoes of a household where both spouses have to go into work and need childcare to stay open, or the people today that found out today they wont be earning a pay for the foreseeable future and the ones already put in that position earlier when they shut some things down. This is going to be a big blow for some people that they may not fully recover from. I feel fortunate I'm still getting a paycheck but cant imagine what hardships those who aren't now are going through.
It's sad people just cant use common sense and have to be forced to limit their interactions so those who cant stay home can still function in some kind of manner. Not everyone has that convenience of being able to work from home. I'd love to if I could but unfortunately I dont have that option so I will continue to put myself at risk everyday supporting employees who work for an essential service. I definitely have been way more dilligent about hand washing and carrying hand sanitizer on me since I have no idea who the people I come in contact with have been around. Im not worried that I will get COVID19 but realize as long as I have to go into a building where thousands of people work it's very possible someone has it or is carrying it.
We'll get through this and come out strong eventually but for now people need to not lose their minds and also use some common sense too. If you have teenage kids at home be a responsible parent and make them stay at home and not going to the mall to hang out with friends. We shouldn't need the government to force us to take steps we should already be doing. It's not a time to argue and fight with each other, it's a time to be united and work together to get through this no matter how frustrating it can be.
It's sad people just cant use common sense and have to be forced to limit their interactions so those who cant stay home can still function in some kind of manner. Not everyone has that convenience of being able to work from home. I'd love to if I could but unfortunately I dont have that option so I will continue to put myself at risk everyday supporting employees who work for an essential service. I definitely have been way more dilligent about hand washing and carrying hand sanitizer on me since I have no idea who the people I come in contact with have been around. Im not worried that I will get COVID19 but realize as long as I have to go into a building where thousands of people work it's very possible someone has it or is carrying it.
We'll get through this and come out strong eventually but for now people need to not lose their minds and also use some common sense too. If you have teenage kids at home be a responsible parent and make them stay at home and not going to the mall to hang out with friends. We shouldn't need the government to force us to take steps we should already be doing. It's not a time to argue and fight with each other, it's a time to be united and work together to get through this no matter how frustrating it can be.
Of course there are blueprints for how to handle this crisis. We just ignored them and/or took way too long to implement them. Belatedly, we're trying to steer this back toward manageability, but the virus is everywhere now and locating it, let alone snuffing it out, is going to take some time.
We aren't going to be isolated in our homes for 18 months. We aren't going to have businesses closed for 18 months. We may have future periods of isolation and closure depending on where and how badly it comes back. But there are lots of things that could mitigate that. There will be times when life is normal-ish and times when it isn't.
But nobody should be under any illusion that instead choosing to do nothing, or some half-measure to what we're doing now, would have yielded anything other than massive economic disruption.
I share the frustration, I really do. But at this point we're talking about the least worst of a whole host of really crappy options. We assured ourselves of that by frittering away those critical early weeks.
Yah. Not too concerned at this point. They get sick often and there's a good likliehood this is just a cold that they're passing along.
A month ago it would have been just a discussion around who's staying home tomorrow. Now, there's a part of my mind that thinks every tired look must be the Covid.
But I'm also of the mindset that we're all getting it eventually. So it's probably best to let it run through the house before the medical facilities are spread thin.
https://www.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/8c4dcccd9e3845eb89f6401f919007f2
US has 941,000 licensed beds, of which 64,400 are ICU beds. Current 49% average hospital bed utilization rate, gives us an idea for what would be needed to all non-COVID19 related disease. Lets say 10 million people are infected at any one time, 5% of which require some form of hospitalization, with 10% of those hospitalized getting intensive care (so only 1 in 200 infected gets an ICU bed). That means 500,000 hospital beds, 50,000 ICU beds, and the increased personnel to manage them. If we could turn those cases around in a week (every week), and keep at 10 million new infections a week, we could get everybody through this in 33 weeks, and probably manage things from an available bed standpoint if infections are spread fairly evenly across the country.
Let's say we do a good job at that....mortality rate might be a little elevated if we can only provide intensive care to 10% of those hospitalized (one publication stated 26% of patients needed intensive care).....but lets say we can keep it at 1.5%. If that's the case, sometime in December we could be past this thing with 4.95 million deaths in the US attributed to COVID19.
I'm not saying you are right or wrong to believe that is the best course moving forward, I'm just saying that by choosing that path you do so knowing that millions will die of respiratory failure.
Also, we are fortunate that WW2 had an established end date so everyone knew ahead of time how long they would have to ration. Really made it easier for them to buy-in for the cause....
Has Cali closed ALL non-essential businesses or not? I work at a decent sized retail store that if non-essential business were to be shut down, that would include us. For now though the company is open until government says so it seems. Traffic has slowed considerably this last week, but today alone I talked to three separate customers that were back from spring break (they flew). Government asked them to stay home but they seemed oblivious and they were mostly in the store for something to do. I’m not too concerned about getting sick myself, but the longer we stay open I can’t imagine it not spreading more.
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