There's certainly games where THT can't miss and is a beast on the offensive end and deserves 30+ min, but I don't recall many games where he's started 1 for 5 and then miraculously made his next 5 shots, so it should be pretty easy for Prohm to know what kind of day Talen's gonna have early on and adjust his substitution plans accordingly as just one example.
Time for new starting lineup????
- Thread starter curtgouty
- Start date
Probably longer than the 1 minute Conditt got at TCU. Particularly given the mistakes the top-7 make with the benefit of ample playing time.
It’s not as high on the issue list as other things, and isn’t easy. But coaching in the Big 12 isn’t easy. Playing the guys that give you the best chance to win and developing the bench have overlap. There have been minutes available to take away from the top-6 that would have benefited the bench a lot more than any deterioration to the starters.
It doesn't really work that way though... Players by nature often can be cold to start a game and work their way into a excellent game once the first shot falls and they get a feel for the D. Not to mention how it could affect the player psyche if they they are concerned with missing a couple of shots and getting pulled from the lineup for long periods. Also just because a player has missed some shots doesn't mean they aren't commanding a lot of defense attention. Replacing even a cold Talen for Zoran for example makes the offense spacing hard for the rest of the players.
Talen and Lindell in particular has been a microwave scorer for their careers, for a players like them you deal with a few of the misses and trust him to figure it out to get the 10-15 point bursts.
Lindell I'll agree, but as I noted, I don't recall any games where THT has started poorly for more than a few minutes and hit that microwave you're speaking of, so in his specific case, what you see early is what you're getting for the game. I'm not saying pull him at the first TV timeout and don't put him back in if he misses 1 or 2 shots, but if by the second TV timeout it's clear he's having an off night, then maybe give Zoran some extended run for the rest of the half and see what happens and if it looks worse, you put THT back in at halftime and he can have the whole second half.
Talley's plenty capable of some nice back cuts and easy layups, so if they don't want to respect his offense, I'll take my chances and it might actually force guys to move the ball a little more rather than the ISO ball they default to when our spacing leads to a good one on one matchup.
I don't think anyone saw Bowie being a big contributor a couple years ago and all of a sudden he became a big piece for us down the stretch, so why not try out some different things for more than 4 minutes the next 2 games? We're stuck in the 4/5 game in the conference tourney, we've been playing like garbage outside of 15 minutes against Oklahoma, and Babb is doubtful to play, so what could it possibly hurt? Not to mention, in Talley's case, he could have a total of 4 meaningful organized basketball games left in his entire life, so I can't imagine someone else bringing more effort than him these next few weeks if he's actually allowed to play.
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All I have to say is Kelvin Cato .... Cam Lard. Cato used to just prowl the pain while the clones played packed in man look and he got so may blocks.
Cato also used to get dunks for days off Kenny Pratt dribble drives against their 3 or 4 man. Cam is a great dunker THT is great and getting in the paint.
Mo Min 4 Cam = Mo Dunks lets roll with dat
Cato also used to get dunks for days off Kenny Pratt dribble drives against their 3 or 4 man. Cam is a great dunker THT is great and getting in the paint.
Mo Min 4 Cam = Mo Dunks lets roll with dat
You realized he led our team in the last game with 6 rebounds right? No one is arguing he is perfect, his turnovers and decision making drives me nuts but getting mad at one of the smallest guys on the floor for not rebounding right after he led the team in the last game is stupid.
Yes.
I'll type it again: there have been times when he is standing there watching the ball instead of boxing out and gets out running before a rebound has been secured.
Is Jolly Time a sponsor? Someone please remove the Blast-O-Butter from the locker room.
Shayok and THT also do this on a regular basis. All three can score, but all three have big holes in their games when it comes to making "winning plays."
Was there anybody for him to box out? Most teams send 3 guys to the boards max. Usually less.
Yeah I should clarify--it's not like he's the only one. The team in general is not good fundamentally for some of those situations.
Just odd if fans just think that there's some glaring reason why he should have been starting.
It would be good for success and all but also really annoying if it all of the sudden 'clicks' for him in those areas due to starting.
At K-State, is an example where THT struggled to start the game, but he was huge in that win scoring 20 points and setting the tone with his aggressive play.
He was 5 for 8 in the first half. I'm not talking about 0 for 2 to start a game. I'm talking 0 for 4 or 1 for 5.
Also, Prohm did pull him after his 0 for 2 start and when he came back in, he started getting hot. I never said you can't still bring him in if he starts poorly. I was using THT as an example of a guy who it's typically easy to spot whether his offense is on, not trying to single him out or call for only him to get less minutes.
We've refused to give Talley extended minutes and Conditts only gotten them in games where Lards suspended. The next 2 games are a perfect opportunity to try and get them more minutes and try some different lineups. I don't care who you sub out. Worst case scenario, you confirm the lineups you've been using are your best options with little to no effect on your postseason seeding, and best case scenario, you find some guys that can be more effective with an expanded role and give us more flexibility in the postseason to adjust lineups based on match-ups.
WVU isn't the team to go 4 posts to start.
If Wade and Osetkowski aren't big's, then neither is Jacobson! Jacobson's natural position is the 4. Plus not many teams have 4 quality 3 point shooters, even if they play 4 guards. So putting Jacobson on the 4th best 3 point shooter isn't much of a risk. He is not going to need to be in the guys face, so he can play off a step to prevent the drive and being 3-4" taller can still impact the shot.
I wouldn't go with a two post starting lineup with Jacobson, Lard or Conditt getting 70-80mpg. But depending on the opponent, I do see the value of trying two posts on the court at the same time and maybe the 3 guys play 50-60mpg.
IMO playing 2 bigs would help congest the lane and make it tougher for opponents to get dribble penetration from the top of the key extended- pick n roll situations. When we switch everything on screens, it is easy to get Jacobson or Lard isolated on a quick guard - advantage quick guard. At the same time the opponent post is being guarded our guard- advantage post.
Getting back to the OP, I do think Coach Prohm should shake up the starting lineup. I would start Wigginton for Halliburton, even if Weiler-Babb plays. No way should Lard start coming back off suspension. That would send a horrible message to the rest of the team. IMO Lard should move to the back of the rotation. Conditt subs in for Jacobson. Lard only plays in the first half if Jacobson or Conditt get in foul trouble.
I think we need Wigginton's offense to start the game. If Weiler-Babb is a game time decision and plays, his knee is in no shape to play 25+ minutes. So I would have Halliburton be the first guy off the bench to sub for NWB, making sure we have a great ball handler in when Nick is out. Then depending on what's needed, I would have Talley or Lewis sub for Horton-Tucker and Shayok.
With this team, I can't recall where Conditt, Lewis, Talley or Griffin have hurt us when they played. They might not be same offensive threats as the starters, but defensively they don't hurt us.
I think we need Wigginton's offense to start the game. If Weiler-Babb is a game time decision and plays, his knee is in no shape to play 25+ minutes. So I would have Halliburton be the first guy off the bench to sub for NWB, making sure we have a great ball handler in when Nick is out. Then depending on what's needed, I would have Talley or Lewis sub for Horton-Tucker and Shayok.
With this team, I can't recall where Conditt, Lewis, Talley or Griffin have hurt us when they played. They might not be same offensive threats as the starters, but defensively they don't hurt us.
Lewis and Griffin getting more minutes are not the solution to this teams problems.
And *move lard to the back of the rotation * is a terrible take.
Some guys just play better when starting, in Wigginton's case he might try to do to much to quickly coming off the bench! We'll see tonight which one it is. If he has a great game maybe he should have been starting since he got healthy! However CSP has to be able to get these guys to hustle which has been missing for a while now!
Yeah, Cam should play the role that he's been playing. Off the bench, his minutes determined by his play or fouls. I would like to see Conditt mixed in there more though.
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