Gmac vs. Dmac

Discussion in 'Mens Basketball' started by clonetil01, Mar 10, 2010.

  1. clonetil01

    clonetil01 Member

    Nov 23, 2009
    433
    14
    18
    Okay, keep in mind, I'm not saying I was against getting rid of Dannymac, just so you know where I stand on that. But, it's hard for me to understand, outside of financial ramifications, how Pollard can give Gmac his glowing endorsement considering that he pulled the plug on a guy who took a doormat program to some nice success. I know Dmac's last year was bad, but look at the consistantly declining performances we've had in BBall in the Big 12 under Gmac. And I really don't buy the financial reason because I know you can drum up cash from donors to make the buy out happen if you really want to. Just thinking out loud.
     
  2. Ciclone

    Ciclone Well-Known Member

    May 5, 2008
    3,320
    199
    63
    Clive
    Because an AD can never really take full credit for the success of a guy he didn't hire. Therefore, it's easier to pull the plug on a guy that's not his own, even if you find the situation similar.
     
  3. I'm not sure about this? Have you done fund raising before? Asking people to donate millions of dollars for buildings, facility upgrades or investment in things that will clearly result in an improvement is extremely hard to begin with, but then to try to get individuals to get out their checkbooks just to help out of a situation that will resolve itself in a couple of years anyway, would be next to impossible. That's just my thoughts, speaking from small-scale fund raising experience.
     
  4. Cyrocks

    Cyrocks Well-Known Member

    Mar 12, 2009
    3,141
    112
    63
    Apples and oranges, my friend, apples and oranges.
     
  5. Cycloin

    Cycloin Well-Known Member

    Feb 5, 2009
    1,058
    125
    63
    Sales
    Johnston
    I am actually tired of the comparison to DM and GM in regards to Jamie Pollard. I think the more accurate comparison is DMac/Gene Smith (year 4, I believe) with GMac/Jamie Pollard. There was considerable debate on whether Gene Smith would or should extend DMac before he had any success at ISU. I think its similar to this situation.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  6. kingcy

    kingcy Well-Known Member

    Sep 16, 2006
    19,901
    443
    83
    Male
    Farm
    Menlo, Iowa
    The finanical thing is BS, the buyout can be made just on lost ticket sales. But I think JP has money and support from donors who want to have Mac as their BB coach. I really think he has donors commited to making up any loss of money from falling BB ticket sales.
     
  7. kingcy

    kingcy Well-Known Member

    Sep 16, 2006
    19,901
    443
    83
    Male
    Farm
    Menlo, Iowa
    Good post. Many didnt think Mac was right for the job going into year 4. Then he beats Iowa and gets an extension. Mac also got the right win at the right time. IMO, if TD isnt RB in Ames when Mac gets here he would have only lasted 4 years.
     
  8. GoShow97

    GoShow97 Well-Known Member

    Oct 18, 2006
    1,844
    85
    48
    mass enlightenment
    homeless
    #8 GoShow97, Mar 10, 2010
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2010
    No doubt about it Danny Mac had alot of consistent "declining performances" as well. It just wasn't the last year - it was pretty much EVERY YEAR. You have to be consistently bad to go 56-87. One good year in twelve.

    3-8
    2-9
    1-10
    3-8
    4-7
    9-3
    7-5
    7-7
    2-10
    7-5
    7-5
    4-8
     
  9. Tedcyclone

    Tedcyclone Well-Known Member

    Oct 27, 2009
    2,827
    68
    48
    vegas hedge fund
    West Des Moines
    i was debating this with myself yesterday. i dont entirely get it, but i think with dmac we def had a better team than anyone in the north, and should have beat several of the teams we didnt. im not entirely convinced in basketball that we do have a better team than most. im not so sure gil is a nba player, brackins is, but we will see. our guards are not the best yet, and we are slow... so i think dmac had a better team and made really bad coaching mistakes even though i loved him. gmac i can decide.. the product looks really bad regardless...
     
  10. CYKOFAN

    CYKOFAN Well-Known Member

    Mar 27, 2006
    4,947
    116
    63
    kingcy- I think the win against K-State was a relief after all the close losses, but I think JP would have come out in support of GMac even had we lost that game, and I thought he said something to that effect. The win was great, but K-State went 3-23 for 3's and that was a great gift since many of them were wide open. If we follow up with a win tonight I'll have more belief that we actually improved at the end of the year.
     
  11. Tre4ISU

    Tre4ISU Well-Known Member

    Dec 30, 2008
    22,445
    794
    113
    Ninja
    Estherville
    Completely different situation. First and foremost, Dan had 12 years and he peaked in year 6. After that he failed to capitalize on that success by bringing in the talent by using that success. He then had absolutely golden opportunities win win the North and never got it done. He had a 0 conference win season and a 1 win season. The talent pool was also not getting deeper. We were not getting to the next level with him and it was evident.

    Now, I know Mac has had no success. He also has had only 4 years. I believe next year is for his job. The difference I see is there has not been a decline in performance. Mac set a precedent with that one season and then he never lived up to it. I believe that precedent, in the end really may have cost him the job.

    At the time I was on the fence for Dan, but in hindsight he just was not going to get us where we want to be. There is a reason he hasn't climbed the ladder again. I love the guy to death and truly believe he is still rooting for us and I also believe he knows it was the right choice for us and likely for himself.

    Greg needs, at worst, the NIT next year. If not he needs to go. If he gets to the NCAA and then in the following years does not and has a couple horrible years then we can compare the two, but right now I don't feel it is fair to Jamie to compare these two. Yes, Dan took over a program in worse shape but he brought it out of that and then it fell off. Look at the talent. Look at the contributors last year. The Seniors and RS juniors were his last class. How many contributed largely? ARob was brought back by Gene so I cannot really give Dan that the credit for him. AA was here no matter who the coach was. Jesse was a walk on. We played a ton of very young guys.
     
  12. tazclone

    tazclone Well-Known Member

    Apr 14, 2006
    9,132
    233
    63
    DMac had lost the fan base just like Morgan had lost the fan base. Even when we were in the running for the North, DMac was losing the fanbase. When we failed to win The North, it solidified it for many fans. Many fans thougth that DMac had done the best he could and the program was stagnating. They did not like his gameday coaching and felt he failed to build on the momentum he had. Since he failed at continued improvement it was time. Whether you agree or not, that is what most fans and in particular big donors felt. We were also ramping up a huge fundraising drive. That could not be accomplished with a fan base that was not supporting their coach or excited about the program. We would not have the upgrades we have today if DMac was kept. At the same time, Morgan was losing the MBB fan base so we were losing in both areas. Firing DMac brought optimism and hope to the fans and alllowed for a lot of fundraising.

    Right now, the FB program has a lot of momentum and since it pays the bills, the financial ramifications are much less. The fanbase as a whole has not given up on GMac. Some view his failures as bad luck, some think he had a growing period to adjust, some understand our APR will be better next year if GMac stays, some want stability in a program that has not had any. Some just want GMac gone. I just don't see as big a % wanting GMac gone as wanted DMac gone. That and MBB doesn't drive the revenue that FB does. WE can withstand another year as long as FB has the momentum and drives the NCC memeberships.
     
  13. Knownothing

    Knownothing Well-Known Member

    Nov 22, 2006
    11,332
    473
    83
    No offense but that is the best 6 year run in Iowa State History right there.
     
  14. Tornado man

    Tornado man Well-Known Member

    Sep 16, 2007
    8,780
    268
    83
    Ames, IA
    You'd better check the starters from last year - most were Dmac recruits.
    Also, you'd better ask AA why he came here over Iowa.
    Aslo, you'd better ask Jesse Smith why he walked on here over other scholarship offers...
     
  15. tazclone

    tazclone Well-Known Member

    Apr 14, 2006
    9,132
    233
    63
    I also don't think JP wanted to pull the plug on DMac. I think if he went with his heart, DMac would still be the coach today. JP respected DMac and liked him but DMaac had lost the fanbase and JP had no option.
     
  16. Tre4ISU

    Tre4ISU Well-Known Member

    Dec 30, 2008
    22,445
    794
    113
    Ninja
    Estherville
    No argument, but the bar was not set high. It wasn't getting better either. Certainly DMac layed the foundation for some sort of success here. He just was not the guy to take it over the top to the land of Championships. I was not inside the fan base then like I am now so I don't know what the feelings were but it seems as if he had lost the fan base almost completely.
     
  17. Leidang

    Leidang Member

    Apr 27, 2006
    419
    22
    18
    I was going to respond but Taz summed it up pretty well. +1
     
  18. Tre4ISU

    Tre4ISU Well-Known Member

    Dec 30, 2008
    22,445
    794
    113
    Ninja
    Estherville
    Looking back on Jesse's career, why was he not offered a scholarship? Perhaps it was because we could get him free at the time, I don't know. Reggie Stephens I believe was the only offensive lineman that was on Mac and that was by far our most solid position group. Our secondary had KB but it is debatable if he was capable of playing there in the Big 12. James Smith was Mac, I will give him that. Our D-line was not good and that is usually a position group that takes a long time to develop so I have a hard time giving Mac a ton of credit there. Jake and Marquis were solid receivers but Darks was better the year before when he was not injured so I have hard time saying he would not have been last year healthy and up until he got hurt Money had done well. Apparent ARob was brought back by Gene after thinking of quitting and there were no RBs that were Macs. I will give you AA although I still think he would have been ours no matter the coach. I can give some credit to Mac for getting ARob here but he did lose him. I am just saying the talent wasn't there like it is now IMO. I am not saying Mac was not getting ANY talent. I am saying it was not what it could have been. I know we cannot judge yet but Rhoads has brought in a better class this year from what we can tell than Mac ever did.
     
  19. JCREEK

    JCREEK Member

    Jan 14, 2010
    322
    17
    18
    Investigator
    dsm

    This is old news he is back are you just spitting up crap Steve Deace said this morning. You are a >ump arse! Do you realize this is the the day we play in the big 12 tourney your stupidity never shocks me anymore. WE have a good football coach dah!!! Get back in your cage!!!
     
  20. CTTB78

    CTTB78 Well-Known Member

    Apr 7, 2006
    4,387
    34
    48
    #20 CTTB78, Mar 10, 2010
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2010
    The main comparison between the two Macs is that both were/are very average coaches that the rest of the league hoped would stay on forever.
     

Share This Page