Clean Burning Efficient Diesels Still Lucrative?

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by CyinCo, May 28, 2008.

  1. CyinCo

    CyinCo Well-Known Member

    Mar 24, 2006
    5,678
    134
    63
    Engineer
    Clive, IA
    So, I'm a big fan of the impending release of the 2009 Jetta TDI. I see they are also making the Sportwagon as a TDI. The new TDI is scheduled to be released this summer as a 2009 model and it will meet California emissions standards (toughest in the world).

    The down side, lately, is the price of Diesel. Seeing the almost $1 premium was a bit scary. However, if you really compare the numbers, I'm still seeing a financial benefit despite the premium for fuel. The estimates are for 55 mpg highway. Given the current fuel prices, I would need to buy a gas car that gets 44.5 highway as an equivalent. I did some research and there aren't very many cars that can even do that highway. The only cars I'm seeing that can are hybrid cars, which I don't want.

    As a comparison, the Civic, Yaris, Fit, and Corolla are all in the high to mid 30's on the highway.

    If we look at city Driving, lets assume that the new TDI will only get 30 city. I actually think it will be better than that. An equivalent gas car would need to get 25 highway in order to match the cost per mile at current fuel prices. Of the cars I listed above, the Yaris does the best at 29 city.

    Add to all of this the "fun" factor that the new TDI will have over comparable efficiency machines, and I think it is no contest.

    I really would love to go get an 2009 but I think I'll wait until the 2010 models, if I can make it that long, to see how things shake out with the new engine, etc.
     
  2. mramseyISU

    mramseyISU Active Member

    Nov 8, 2006
    1,531
    17
    38
    Male
    Operator Station Engineer
    Waterloo, IA
    I think somebody should be making a small 4-door pickup (ranger, colorado) with something like a 3.5 liter turbo diesel. I think you'd sell the crap out of them. Ford already has a 3.6L diesel in land rovers they sell across the pond getting 30 mpg. You put a pick-up SUV on the market now that gets 30 mpg you'd sell a ton of them.
     
  3. CyinCo

    CyinCo Well-Known Member

    Mar 24, 2006
    5,678
    134
    63
    Engineer
    Clive, IA
    Agreed. I think there is still a negative perception to diesel engines. People still believe they will be loud and stinky. I think that no longer will be the case.
     
  4. jbhtexas

    jbhtexas Well-Known Member

    Oct 20, 2006
    12,035
    480
    83
    Arlington, TX
    Agreed again. Way back in the early '80s, during the last gas crunch, diesel vehicles were more prevalent. Ford had an Escort diesel. There was even a short production run of Lincoln Mark VII diesels. In fact, it would seem that most consumers around the world presently have a nice selection of diesel passenger vehicles, SUVs, and light trucks to choose from, except for us here in the good ol' US of A...
     
  5. Phaedrus

    Phaedrus Well-Known Member

    Jan 13, 2008
    5,111
    304
    83
    Military Contracting
    Khorasan
    One of the biggest attractions to diesel in my eyes is the ability to burn bio-diesel. In fact, in warmer weather, you should be able to throw a gallon of cooking oil in the tank, and not notice the difference.

    People around here routinely burn cooking oil, or commercial rapeseed oil in their diesel vehicles. You can tell when they drive by by the smell of french fries in the air.

    Note to self: Don't do this during colder weather. It would suck to have to try to get that out of your fuel system, all gelled and stuff.
     
  6. jbhtexas

    jbhtexas Well-Known Member

    Oct 20, 2006
    12,035
    480
    83
    Arlington, TX
    Same here.

    Also, solving the cold-weather gelling problem is just a matter of time. Supposedly, there is a product in Europe called Wintron XC30 that significantly decreases the pour point of B100.
     
  7. mustangwinner97

    Mar 30, 2006
    241
    3
    18
    La Porte City
  8. kgreeny

    kgreeny Well-Known Member

    Apr 11, 2006
    1,241
    25
    48
    I tried to buy the wife one of the Jettas a couple of years back, but it didn't come in the color she liked.:no:. To a woman, I guess that is the most important thing.
     
  9. jbhtexas

    jbhtexas Well-Known Member

    Oct 20, 2006
    12,035
    480
    83
    Arlington, TX
    According to that one Cadillac Escalade commercial that's running now, it's the number of cupholders that most important to a woman...

    Cadillac - GM Sites

    look for "CUPHOLDERS"...
     
  10. mramseyISU

    mramseyISU Active Member

    Nov 8, 2006
    1,531
    17
    38
    Male
    Operator Station Engineer
    Waterloo, IA
    I've had the same cup holder in every vehicle I've ever owned, my lap.
     
  11. Wesley

    Wesley Well-Known Member

    Apr 12, 2006
    70,964
    542
    113
    Envr Engr/Program Manager
    Omaha
    $4.75 per gallon for diesel since Europeans and trucks need so much of it might negate the mileage gain.
     
  12. CyinCo

    CyinCo Well-Known Member

    Mar 24, 2006
    5,678
    134
    63
    Engineer
    Clive, IA
    Apparently you didn't read or didn't understand my very first post. The cost doesn't negate the mileage gain.
     
  13. mramseyISU

    mramseyISU Active Member

    Nov 8, 2006
    1,531
    17
    38
    Male
    Operator Station Engineer
    Waterloo, IA
    Diesels are on average 30-40% more effecient that gas. So at that $4.75 it's the equivilent of gas being between $3.39 and $3.65. Last I checked I paying more than that for gas here and less than $4.75 for diesel.
     
  14. dmclone

    dmclone Well-Known Member

    Oct 20, 2006
    15,693
    393
    83
    50131
  15. Wesley

    Wesley Well-Known Member

    Apr 12, 2006
    70,964
    542
    113
    Envr Engr/Program Manager
    Omaha

    Ah, then you see my point. That is for now.

    If more people switch to diesel, the price differential may increase to negate the advantage. The Europeans and trucks are stuck on diesel, we are not stuck on gasoline and could switch to diesel. This has been a big swing in the last two years.
     
  16. dmclone

    dmclone Well-Known Member

    Oct 20, 2006
    15,693
    393
    83
    50131
    I think it would be best to wait until MY 2010-2011. There are going to be a lot more options. I think there will be at least 3 more good electric vehicles by then. Honda will also have a diesel by 2010.I can't wait to see how the Volt is priced when it comes out. Nissan is also working on an electric hybrid.
     
  17. Wesley

    Wesley Well-Known Member

    Apr 12, 2006
    70,964
    542
    113
    Envr Engr/Program Manager
    Omaha
    Toyota is doubling their battery production capability. Plug in electric is needed as an option.
     
  18. C.John

    C.John Perplexed
    Staff Member

    Mar 23, 2006
    15,800
    318
    83
    Personally, I'd like a Jeep Wrangler with small diesel that was thrifty on fuel while still offering plenty of low end torque. Enough grunt for going off road while still being efficient around town. And I want it in Tangerine Orange.
     
  19. jbhtexas

    jbhtexas Well-Known Member

    Oct 20, 2006
    12,035
    480
    83
    Arlington, TX
    I'm looking to buy a used 2004-2006 Jetta TDI. That Jetta is a lighter car, and gets better mileage. Diesels also usually end up getting better real world mileage than the EPA sticker, especially on the highway part.
     
  20. Clonefan94

    Clonefan94 Well-Known Member

    Oct 18, 2006
    7,574
    261
    83
    Male
    Graphic Designer
    Schaumburg, IL
    This will be the next new car I buy. I've been looking, but, so far the only real electric car I've found either isn't in the US or only goes 25mph. I don't drive far at all to work. Riding a bike every day isn't an option as I have to get the kids to daycare. But, still, I'm only driving about 10 miles/day. So, If I could get an electric car that gives me 15 miles per day and I can go at least 40 mph for at least half of those miles I'm golden. I have two roads I have to drive on that if I only go even as slow as 30 mph. Someone would end up shooting me. As soon as I see that car on the market and I can buy it at a reasonable price (around the price of a decent new car) and somewehre close to Chicago, it's mine.

    I would even pay a premium price never to have to stop at a gas station for anything other than a soft drink and a candybar again.
     

Share This Page