Gartner-Tuition Increase:Wrong on Every Front
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    Gartner-Tuition Increase:Wrong on Every Front


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    Re: Gartner-Tuition Increase:Wrong on Every Front

    I can't really say I disagree with anything in the article, minus the athletics cost thing. What the hell does that have to do with tuition? Additionally, the AD is a separate entity from Iowa State University's general fund. How about we get rid of the headache known as tenure. That'll save a TON of money in the long run.



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    Re: Gartner-Tuition Increase:Wrong on Every Front

    Everyone knows the tuition increases are a problem. He doesnt offer many meaningful suggesetions for other solutions though. His suggestions:

    That means increasing teaching loads — most faculty teach no more than two courses a semester.
    Of course any time in the classroom takes faculty away from research, which bring in a decent amount of funding too.

    It means eliminating courses and whole departments where there is little demand for services or duplication within the system.
    Eliminate more majors and force students to switch schools if they want to change. No thanks.

    It means selling assets that aren’t essential to education.
    Such as?

    It means using resources more efficiently — like scheduling Friday and Saturday and evening classes.
    There are less friday classes because there is no *demand* for friday classes. Who here didnt try to get as early of a start of a weekend as possible? My last semester i had no class friday and didnt start again until 4pm monday.

    It means going head-to-head against the for-profits by offering inexpensive “distance learning.”
    This is probably the one that i do like, and a few business professors were advocating this when i was there.

    It means getting athletic costs under control.
    The ISU and UofI (dont know about UNI) are largely self sufficient. The small amount they do take in pays back many fold when you consider athletics is one of the greatest ways you can keep alumni (and their $$) connected to the university. These $$ can effectively be considered marketing $$.

    It means more sharing among the three universities — consolidation of functions and sharing of faculty, of resources and of students.
    again... forcing students to switch to UNI or UofI just to switch majors. No thanks.



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    Re: Gartner-Tuition Increase:Wrong on Every Front

    Quote Originally Posted by alarson View Post
    Everyone knows the tuition increases are a problem. He doesnt offer many meaningful suggesetions for other solutions though. His suggestions:


    Of course any time in the classroom takes faculty away from research, which bring in a decent amount of funding too.


    Eliminate more majors and force students to switch schools if they want to change. No thanks.


    Such as?


    There are less friday classes because there is no *demand* for friday classes. Who here didnt try to get as early of a start of a weekend as possible? My last semester i had no class friday and didnt start again until 4pm monday.


    This is probably the one that i do like, and a few business professors were advocating this when i was there.

    The ISU and UofI (dont know about UNI) are largely self sufficient. The small amount they do take in pays back many fold when you consider athletics is one of the greatest ways you can keep alumni (and their $$) connected to the university. These $$ can effectively be considered marketing $$.


    again... forcing students to switch to UNI or UofI just to switch majors. No thanks.
    I actually completely agree that the 3 state schools shouldn't have a ton of overlap in majors, nor should they have overlap in colleges. Iowa State's College of Business dumping Operations and Supply Chain Management and Logistics and Supply Chain Management to just form Supply Chain Management was long overdue. The number of people in those majors is not very high, so there's no reason to have a ton of professors who specialize in it. As far as I'm concerned, Iowa, Iowa State, and UNI don't all need separate colleges of business, nor should they offer certain degree programs that a handful of people graduate from every year. There is a TON of suboptimization at the universities.



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    Re: Gartner-Tuition Increase:Wrong on Every Front

    I think a valid question to ask is where were these ideas when Gartner was Board President. While his time as President was less rocky than this it is still the duty of the Board to plan for the future and not simply react to the present.



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    Re: Gartner-Tuition Increase:Wrong on Every Front

    Quote Originally Posted by d4nim4l View Post
    I think a valid question to ask is where were these ideas when Gartner was Board President. While his time as President was less rocky than this it is still the duty of the Board to plan for the future and not simply react to the present.
    I'll admit I don't know any facts surrounding his time as President, but don't you think that since he was one of two to vote against this increase that maybe his ideas weren't supported?



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    Re: Gartner-Tuition Increase:Wrong on Every Front

    Quote Originally Posted by IcSyU View Post
    I can't really say I disagree with anything in the article, minus the athletics cost thing. What the hell does that have to do with tuition? Additionally, the AD is a separate entity from Iowa State University's general fund. How about we get rid of the headache known as tenure. That'll save a TON of money in the long run.
    How will that save money in the long run? Will it reduce the amount of faculty needed? Will it lower salaries?


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    Re: Gartner-Tuition Increase:Wrong on Every Front

    Quote Originally Posted by CloneAggie View Post
    How will that save money in the long run? Will it reduce the amount of faculty needed? Will it lower salaries?
    It ensures that salary is being earned. Tenure makes it difficult for Iowa State to fire any professor not pulling their weight. With no tenure plan, professors not fulfilling their job requirements can be let go, and new professors brought in without penalty. "Just cause" is so vaguely defined that underachieving in regards to expectations will inevitably lead to a wrongful termination lawsuit. I work at Iowa State for 5-7 years, get tenure, sign another contract for 5-7 years, and they are pretty much stuck with me no matter the amount of work I do. I may not be actually teaching anything, or give a **** about my students, but I'm making money, so who cares? That's not how higher education should work.



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    Re: Gartner-Tuition Increase:Wrong on Every Front

    Quote Originally Posted by IcSyU View Post
    It ensures that salary is being earned. Tenure makes it difficult for Iowa State to fire any professor not pulling their weight. With no tenure plan, professors not fulfilling their job requirements can be let go, and new professors brought in without penalty. "Just cause" is so vaguely defined that underachieving in regards to expectations will inevitably lead to a wrongful termination lawsuit. I work at Iowa State for 5-7 years, get tenure, sign another contract for 5-7 years, and they are pretty much stuck with me no matter the amount of work I do. I may not be actually teaching anything, or give a **** about my students, but I'm making money, so who cares? That's not how higher education should work.
    Agree, but then it would have to be across the board at every University in the country. Otherwise, why would any decent faculty member want to be at a school that doesn't offer it.



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    Re: Gartner-Tuition Increase:Wrong on Every Front

    Quote Originally Posted by IcSyU View Post
    It ensures that salary is being earned. Tenure makes it difficult for Iowa State to fire any professor not pulling their weight. With no tenure plan, professors not fulfilling their job requirements can be let go, and new professors brought in without penalty.
    Tenured faculty that are not fulfilling their job requirements are usually getting paid less than rookie professors. While getting rid of the tenure system would get rid of the professors that don't do research or perform poorly in the classroom, it is by no means a surefire way to save a TON of money, because you would be replacing them with active advanced professors (i.e., definitely a higher salary) or with rookie professors (i.e., likely a higher salary). It certainly could mean the money is spent on more productive faculty. However, money spent better doesn't necessarily mean less money spent. In fact, an argument could be made that professors are willing to accept less money for the potential job security that tenure provides.
    Quote Originally Posted by IcSyU View Post
    "Just cause" is so vaguely defined that underachieving in regards to expectations will inevitably lead to a wrongful termination lawsuit. I work at Iowa State for 5-7 years, get tenure, sign another contract for 5-7 years, and they are pretty much stuck with me no matter the amount of work I do. I may not be actually teaching anything, or give a **** about my students, but I'm making money, so who cares? That's not how higher education should work.
    I find it very hard to believe there are professors not teaching or doing research (aside from a sabbatical year). Again, getting rid of the tenure system may mean that the money is being spent more effectively, but it does not mean less money will be spent.


    Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that. ~ George Carlin

    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life:
    The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves Orcs. ~ John Rogers

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