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  1. #1
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    Have we lost everything?

    I was talking to some friends here at work and was wondering everyone's opinion. Have we lost everything that Orr, Flyod, and LE had built up? I remember the time when no one wanted to play at Hilton, now the magic is gone. Heck we can hardly compete in the Big 12 anymore. I personally see the last couple years as a disgrace to Iowa State basketball, we have hit rock bottom and all the heart and hard work that Orr, Floyd, and LE put into this program is gone.



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    Re: Have we lost everything?

    It just takes winning and almost all of the magic will be back.


    Hooray for Metaphors!

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    Re: Have we lost everything?

    Quote Originally Posted by UNIGuy4Cy View Post
    I was talking to some friends here at work and was wondering everyone's opinion. Have we lost everything that Orr, Flyod, and LE had built up? I remember the time when no one wanted to play at Hilton, now the magic is gone. Heck we can hardly compete in the Big 12 anymore. I personally see the last couple years as a disgrace to Iowa State basketball, we have hit rock bottom and all the heart and hard work that Orr, Floyd, and LE put into this program is gone.

    It is time to let this guy go. Really, we NEED a new coach to fix this thing.



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    Re: Have we lost everything?

    We lost that a long time ago, LE didn't build anything, he had two great years his first two seasons with a McDonald's All-American he inherited and caught lightning in a bottle with a Juco who didn't get recruited by anyone else since he didn't even graduate from high school who turned out to be a difference maker.
    After Tinsley was gone though LE's teams sucked. He didn't capitalize on that run and we've been trying to dig out of the hole ever since.
    So have we lost it, yeah, but McDermott didn't lose anything, he just hasn't built it back up.



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    Re: Have we lost everything?

    Getting close...


    next year will start looking like Carver West if current program is still in place.


    Last edited by Palmer; 02-11-2010 at 10:08 AM.
    Carrying the banner for ISU.


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    Re: Have we lost everything?

    I think I've finally figured it out.

    1. Our talent is still below average in the B12, we just thought it was much better because of how bad it's been the past 3 seasons.

    2. This team is good enough to finish in the top half of the B12 up until 4-5 years ago. In the past 4,5,6 years these teams that we'd normally be able to beat: Tech, aTm, Baylor and KState have all had TREMENDOUS upgrades in recruiting and the type of players on the roster. We're being out-recruited by the teams for several years now that we used to beat up on, period.


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    Re: Have we lost everything?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Architect View Post
    I think I've finally figured it out.

    1. Our talent is still below average in the B12, we just thought it was much better because of how bad it's been the past 3 seasons.

    2. This team is good enough to finish in the top half of the B12 up until 4-5 years ago. In the past 4,5,6 years these teams that we'd normally be able to beat: Tech, aTm, Baylor and KState have all had TREMENDOUS upgrades in recruiting and the type of players on the roster. We're being out-recruited by the teams for several years now that we used to beat up on, period.
    Exactly. On point #1, this is why Scottie has been way overrated by so many of our fans.... because he is the first guard we have had who can both dribble and shoot since Taylor and Dunson left. He is average at best right now but he looked so good at the start of the year because we have been watching so many poor guards for years.



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    Re: Have we lost everything?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Architect View Post
    I think I've finally figured it out.

    1. Our talent is still below average in the B12, we just thought it was much better because of how bad it's been the past 3 seasons.

    2. This team is good enough to finish in the top half of the B12 up until 4-5 years ago. In the past 4,5,6 years these teams that we'd normally be able to beat: Tech, aTm, Baylor and KState have all had TREMENDOUS upgrades in recruiting and the type of players on the roster. We're being out-recruited by the teams for several years now that we used to beat up on, period.
    You forgot to mention that our team is consistently outcoached, too.

    Out-recruited + Out-coached = Cellar dwellers for four years now.



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    Re: Have we lost everything?

    Quote Originally Posted by soccercy View Post
    We lost that a long time ago, LE didn't build anything, he had two great years his first two seasons with a McDonald's All-American he inherited and caught lightning in a bottle with a Juco who didn't get recruited by anyone else since he didn't even graduate from high school who turned out to be a difference maker.
    After Tinsley was gone though LE's teams sucked. He didn't capitalize on that run and we've been trying to dig out of the hole ever since.
    So have we lost it, yeah, but McDermott didn't lose anything, he just hasn't built it back up.
    That's a pretty good analysis of the whole situation. LE was handed a great situation by his best friend Floyd.


    Last edited by aauummm; 02-11-2010 at 09:31 AM.

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    Re: Have we lost everything?

    Quote Originally Posted by Palmer View Post
    Getting close...


    next year will start looking like Carver east if current program is still in place.

    That is what scares me. We have some loyal fans but there comes a time when you can only take so much. The worst thing that can happen to a program is losing its fan and therefore financial support. On the other hand, I can't blame people who are getting fed up with the product we have seen the last 4 years.

    I love going to Hilton like so many others, but when you're not seeing any sort of change, it becomes so frustrating.



  11. #11
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    Re: Have we lost everything?

    Quote Originally Posted by DRCHIRO View Post
    That is what scares me. We have some loyal fans but there comes a time when you can only take so much. The worst thing that can happen to a program is losing its fan and therefore financial support. On the other hand, I can't blame people who are getting fed up with the product we have seen the last 4 years.

    I love going to Hilton like so many others, but when you're not seeing any sort of change, it becomes so frustrating.
    One thing I've learned over the years is that a whole lot of people like to sound important by making threats like withdrawing support, or threatening to quit a job when they don't get their way, or whatever, but they are almost all all talk.


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  12. #12
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    Re: Have we lost everything?

    Quote Originally Posted by DRCHIRO View Post
    That is what scares me. We have some loyal fans but there comes a time when you can only take so much. The worst thing that can happen to a program is losing its fan and therefore financial support. On the other hand, I can't blame people who are getting fed up with the product we have seen the last 4 years.

    I love going to Hilton like so many others, but when you're not seeing any sort of change, it becomes so frustrating.

    I am with you brother......it is going to be ugly next year.


    I cannot justify the cost of my 5 tickets for MBB with the return value... and have already made plans to funnel the funds to our football allotment


    Carrying the banner for ISU.


  13. #13
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    Re: Have we lost everything?

    Quote Originally Posted by Palmer View Post
    I am with you brother......it is going to be ugly next year.


    I cannot justify the cost of my 5 tickets for MBB and have already made plans to funnel the funds to our football allotment
    You've survived Kottman. You've also survived worse basketball than this team puts out there. Much worse. Quit now, it's your loss.


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    Re: Have we lost everything?

    Quote Originally Posted by soccercy View Post
    We lost that a long time ago, LE didn't build anything, he had two great years his first two seasons with a McDonald's All-American he inherited and caught lightning in a bottle with a Juco who didn't get recruited by anyone else since he didn't even graduate from high school who turned out to be a difference maker.
    After Tinsley was gone though LE's teams sucked. He didn't capitalize on that run and we've been trying to dig out of the hole ever since.
    So have we lost it, yeah, but McDermott didn't lose anything, he just hasn't built it back up.
    . Erroneous! First, it wasn't LE's first two years that were good, it was the second and third year. That suggests that he built something after Floyd left, although admittedly that was easier with Fizer already on the roster. Second, it's really too bad that LE went down in flames when he did. LE's coaching, combined with WM's recruits, would have led to very favorable results. With LE coaching Stinsson, Blaylock, Clark, Carr, and Taggert, I think it's possible we would have a few more B12 championship banners hanging from the rafters of Hilton.



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    Re: Have we lost everything?

    Quote Originally Posted by GoCubsGo View Post
    . Erroneous! First, it wasn't LE's first two years that were good, it was the second and third year. That suggests that he built something after Floyd left, although admittedly that was easier with Fizer already on the roster. Second, it's really too bad that LE went down in flames when he did. LE's coaching, combined with WM's recruits, would have led to very favorable results. With LE coaching Stinsson, Blaylock, Clark, Carr, and Taggert, I think it's possible we would have a few more B12 championship banners hanging from the rafters of Hilton.
    It's just as possible that his coaching style had accomplished all that it actually could. History isn't an exact science, and I think it's far from certain that he would have accomplished what we all wish with those guys. Maybe, maybe not, but there isn't a way to know.
    Really time for us fans to let that ship sail. Playing "what if" with the past really doesn't accomplish much.


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