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  1. #1
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    Vaccinations...what have you done for your kids?

    The more I read about the government's vaccinations program, and the history of lies, corruption and what I think is collusion, my wife and I are torn on how far down the vaccination road with our infant.

    Some of the documented and proven things I have read involving the government and big pharma...it makes me spitting mad...and the list of things you have to sign off on before you get your kids shots...the possible side effects...then if you dont want to sign it, they wont give the shots, and if you dont get the shots, you can't get your kids in school...

    Did you realize that a portion of the money you/your insurance pays for vaccinations goes into a fund to pay death or disabled benefits to those families whose children are adversely affected?

    what have you done? have you fought it?


    Last edited by JonDMiller; 07-29-2009 at 07:12 AM.
    'Until things are brighter, I'm the man in black.'

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    Re: Vaccinations...what have you done for your kids?

    The damage done by not vaccinating children would far outweight the damage done by vaccinating them.

    You don't seem like a conspiracy guy to me but it looks like I was wrong.


    “Science investigates; religion interprets. Science gives man knowledge, which is power; religion gives man wisdom, which is control. Science deals mainly with facts; religion deals mainly with values. The two are not rivals. They are complementary.”

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    Re: Vaccinations...what have you done for your kids?

    Quote Originally Posted by Incyte View Post
    The damage done by not vaccinating children would far outweight the damage done by vaccinating them.

    You don't seem like a conspiracy guy to me but it looks like I was wrong.
    what evidence or documentation do you have to make this claim? Granted, Miller didn't cite anything either........


    Quote Originally Posted by JonDMiller View Post

    Dosry, You know what? I think I'll agree with you :)

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    Re: Vaccinations...what have you done for your kids?

    Quote Originally Posted by JonDMiller View Post
    The more I read about the government's vaccinations program, and the history of lies, corruption and what I think is collusion, my wife and I are torn on how far down the vaccination road with our infant.

    Some of the documented and proven things I have read involving the government and big pharma...it makes me spitting mad...and the list of things you have to sign off on before you get your kids shots...the possible side effects...then if you dont want to sign it, they wont give the shots, and if you dont get the shots, you can't get your kids in school...

    Did you realize that a portion of the money you/your insurance pays for vaccinations goes into a fund to pay death or disabled benefits to those families whose children are adversely affected?

    I think its a sick scam...what have you done? have you fought it?
    Have you been hanging out with this guy again?



    They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. - Benjamin Franklin 1775

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    Re: Vaccinations...what have you done for your kids?

    Quote Originally Posted by dosry5 View Post
    what evidence or documentation do you have to make this claim? Granted, Miller didn't cite anything either........

    I listen to a lot of DoctorRadio on my XM during the day and they discussed the risks associated with vaccines. Studies have found no correlation between Mercury levels and autism. I admit I have not read the studies myself.


    “Science investigates; religion interprets. Science gives man knowledge, which is power; religion gives man wisdom, which is control. Science deals mainly with facts; religion deals mainly with values. The two are not rivals. They are complementary.”

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    Re: Vaccinations...what have you done for your kids?

    My son has had all of the standard vaccinations. Honestly, to me it's a matter of odds with vaccinations as well as with other medicine. An effective drug will help far more people than it hurts, and of course the odds must be weighed out. Everyone on the planet has a unique makeup, and what saves one will kill another. As long as it effectively saves far more than it harms, I think it's worthwhile, assuming that what it prevents poses significant health risks. I think tort reform needs to be done with this in mind.

    A non-drug example.......DDT. If I recall correctly, DDT was banned for the potential health problems it could cause (as well as for theoretically making bird's eggshells thinner), but since there was no immediately available insecticide to take it's place that was as effective, malaria killed far, far more people than were ever saved by it's banning.

    DDT vs. Death by Malaria

    What the World Needs Now Is DDT - The New York Times



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    Re: Vaccinations...what have you done for your kids?

    Quote Originally Posted by Incyte View Post
    The damage done by not vaccinating children would far outweight the damage done by vaccinating them.
    There were on the record and documented reports that cases of polio were in decline before the vaccination process began...same for diptheria. Why are we getting infants vaccinated for Hepatitis B, as infants, when they are the least likely to run into this? Why are we giving infants vaccinations for tetanus when they are the least likely to encounter this, and when we do encounter it, or a fear of having encountered it, we can get a shot for it then?

    I have read quite a bit on this...there are documented instances where government agencies altered reports and numbers, such as in the case of the polio vaccines...I can't provide the links right now as I am on a show break, but I am not just making them up and can provide links.

    Then you have the conflict of interest with people on committees that also had vested interests in pharma companies that produce vaccines...then you have some pharma companies saying they removed even trace levels of mercury, yet years later, there was still mercury in some of the vaccines they said were not. These are all documented, because I cross referenced it in the books I have read to make sure its not just Jenny McCarthy saying it.

    These vaccines are a billion dollar industry..just a few years ago, they had to drop a rotovirus vaccine because they found it was doing a lot of harm...then they rushed another one to market, and we don't know yet.

    Do we really need a vaccine for this stuff? Is the risk worth it, in the instance of chicken pox, or rotovirus?

    Some of these things that used to kill or harm more people, that was back in a time when we were a much dirtier society...we are too clean now, probably. Things like asthma, autism, attention deficit disorders...they are skyrocketing in this country at rates far outstripping the rest of the world...as we have gone from like 8 vaccinations when we were kids, to over 35 now...how should it be that way, when we are a much cleaner nation, much more modernized than we have ever been?

    Just like they thought thalidomide was good to give for mothers back in the day to help with pregnancy issues...until they then realized it was deforming babies. Yeah, I am a little distrusting when billions of dollars meets people in power...and there are documented instances where corruption has takenthe stage over the health of the people.

    It's not like big tobacco cared for people...and the government looked the other way for a long time.

    We are talking about the most precious things in the world. Yeah, I am a little skeptical of a system that forces you to sign a piece of paper that details some frightening risk...and if you don't sign it, then your kid can't go to public school that you are also forced to pay for.

    I guess you can get around some of these, saying they go against your religious beliefs. Did some of you know that aborted fetus materials are used in some of these vaccines? I bet you didn't. But it's fact.

    This isn't some 'man never went to the moon' conspiracy.

    As for the risks are more if you dont get 36 vaccinations...I just don't think that is the case, because they are using preindustrial revolution and 20's-40's numbers as a baseline...we were a much more dirty and less clean nation at that time...its not an apples to apples comparison.. I am fine with some vaccinations. I just think going from 8 when we were kids to 36 and all these boosters now, is alarming.


    'Until things are brighter, I'm the man in black.'

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    Re: Vaccinations...what have you done for your kids?

    Quote Originally Posted by JonDMiller View Post
    There were on the record and documented reports that cases of polio were in decline before the vaccination process began...same for diptheria. Why are we getting infants vaccinated for Hepatitis B, as infants, when they are the least likely to run into this? Why are we giving infants vaccinations for tetanus when they are the least likely to encounter this, and when we do encounter it, or a fear of having encountered it, we can get a shot for it then?

    I have read quite a bit on this...there are documented instances where government agencies altered reports and numbers, such as in the case of the polio vaccines...I can't provide the links right now as I am on a show break, but I am not just making them up and can provide links.

    Then you have the conflict of interest with people on committees that also had vested interests in pharma companies that produce vaccines...then you have some pharma companies saying they removed even trace levels of mercury, yet years later, there was still mercury in some of the vaccines they said were not. These are all documented, because I cross referenced it in the books I have read to make sure its not just Jenny McCarthy saying it.

    These vaccines are a billion dollar industry..just a few years ago, they had to drop a rotovirus vaccine because they found it was doing a lot of harm...then they rushed another one to market, and we don't know yet.

    Do we really need a vaccine for this stuff? Is the risk worth it, in the instance of chicken pox, or rotovirus?

    Some of these things that used to kill or harm more people, that was back in a time when we were a much dirtier society...we are too clean now, probably. Things like asthma, autism, attention deficit disorders...they are skyrocketing in this country at rates far outstripping the rest of the world...as we have gone from like 8 vaccinations when we were kids, to over 35 now...how should it be that way, when we are a much cleaner nation, much more modernized than we have ever been?

    Just like they thought thalidomide was good to give for mothers back in the day to help with pregnancy issues...until they then realized it was deforming babies. Yeah, I am a little distrusting when billions of dollars meets people in power...and there are documented instances where corruption has takenthe stage over the health of the people.

    It's not like big tobacco cared for people...and the government looked the other way for a long time.

    We are talking about the most precious things in the world. Yeah, I am a little skeptical of a system that forces you to sign a piece of paper that details some frightening risk...and if you don't sign it, then your kid can't go to public school that you are also forced to pay for.

    I guess you can get around some of these, saying they go against your religious beliefs. Did some of you know that aborted fetus materials are used in some of these vaccines? I bet you didn't. But it's fact.

    This isn't some 'man never went to the moon' conspiracy.

    As for the risks are more if you dont get 36 vaccinations...I just don't think that is the case, because they are using preindustrial revolution and 20's-40's numbers as a baseline...we were a much more dirty and less clean nation at that time...its not an apples to apples comparison.. I am fine with some vaccinations. I just think going from 8 when we were kids to 36 and all these boosters now, is alarming.
    I hope people discuss this with their family physician rather than take the word of a sports talk-show crackpot and Jenny McCarthy. These aren't good sources of scientific reasoning.


    “Science investigates; religion interprets. Science gives man knowledge, which is power; religion gives man wisdom, which is control. Science deals mainly with facts; religion deals mainly with values. The two are not rivals. They are complementary.”

    Martin Luther King Jr.

  9. #9
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    Re: Vaccinations...what have you done for your kids?

    Quote Originally Posted by Incyte View Post
    I hope people discuss this with their family physician rather than take the word of a sports talk-show crackpot and Jenny McCarthy. These aren't good sources of scientific reasoning.
    Of course they shouldnt. That is why I am asking people what they have done.

    But I think a lot of people bury their heads in the sand and have no freaking clue about any of the FACTUAL AND DOCUMENTED history of the vaccination programs in this country. You are acting like there isn't proof, court cases, basic admissions of corruption and horrible mistakes and that its all made up.

    I would rather my child get the rotovirus, than take a vaccine that hasn't been tested for decades...my daughter and I had it a few years ago...it sucked...but I would rather have that risk.


    'Until things are brighter, I'm the man in black.'

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    Re: Vaccinations...what have you done for your kids?

    Quote Originally Posted by Incyte View Post
    I hope people discuss this with their family physician rather than take the word of a sports talk-show crackpot and Jenny McCarthy. These aren't good sources of scientific reasoning.
    Problem with this though--a simple family physician, are they really up to date and the best source of information? It's a knee jerk reaction to say "yes" immediately. In realistic terms, more often than not, it seems the average family physician is a very busy person in a very busy practice and probably isn't as nuanced on subjects like this as you'd like them to be. Having the title "Dr" before your name doesn't just make you right. Plenty of Dr.'s are beholden to the drug companies.


    Quote Originally Posted by JonDMiller View Post

    Dosry, You know what? I think I'll agree with you :)

    Quote Originally Posted by bos
    You sir are a legend.

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    Re: Vaccinations...what have you done for your kids?

    later tonight, I'll come back and cite a string of sources. I can understand being skeptical, because its the web after all.


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    Re: Vaccinations...what have you done for your kids?

    Quote Originally Posted by JonDMiller View Post
    Of course they shouldnt. That is why I am asking people what they have done.

    But I think a lot of people bury their heads in the sand and have no freaking clue about any of the FACTUAL AND DOCUMENTED history of the vaccination programs in this country. You are acting like there isn't proof, court cases, basic admissions of corruption and horrible mistakes and that its all made up.

    I would rather my child get the rotovirus, than take a vaccine that hasn't been tested for decades...my daughter and I had it a few years ago...it sucked...but I would rather have that risk.

    Did you get all delirious? Is that why you put me on the ignore list?


    Quote Originally Posted by JonDMiller View Post

    Dosry, You know what? I think I'll agree with you :)

    Quote Originally Posted by bos
    You sir are a legend.

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    Re: Vaccinations...what have you done for your kids?

    As a parent I have mixed feelings, especially when you hear the stories from parents whose kids seem to have had reactions or side effects.

    I still think for many it is the question of the more benefit than harm, and that is easy to say when you are discussing the health of the our children in aggregate, not as a parent.

    On a side note, topics like this really make me wonder about what is causing the increase in a lot of children s health problems and allergies, maybe I do not remember it (pure conjecture), but it seems like 30 years ago we did not see the prevalence of ADHD, Autism, allergies (milk and peanut). It makes you wonder what is changing. Again, I am only quoting a feeling, not established numbers, so what I am assuming may not be accurate.



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    Re: Vaccinations...what have you done for your kids?

    Quote Originally Posted by Incyte View Post
    I hope people discuss this with their family physician rather than take the word of a sports talk-show crackpot and Jenny McCarthy. These aren't good sources of scientific reasoning.
    Oh yes, your family physician who gets treated very well by big pharma.



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    Re: Vaccinations...what have you done for your kids?

    Maybe you should visit with your doctor about the facts instead of opinions on web sites.



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