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    Rationalizing 2008 and beyond

    Okay, since my suicide watch from last weeks game, and several other posts that have at least convinced me that the end of the Cyclone world may not necessarily be coming. I need a release, a injection of optimism, so i decided to try and rationalize where we are talent wise and what we have coming in to offset our losses for next year. This is only on the offensive side of the ball.

    2009 Depth Chart
    QB
    Arnaud - Junior
    Tiller - R. Freshman

    2008 Lost - Bates (Quit)
    Incoming - None yet.
    From all reports, the loss of Bates as an athlete is unfortunate, but, everything points to Tiller being a better all around prospect in the first place. Also, i didn't realize Tillers size (6'-4") and is supposed to have a cannon. I look for us to add a prospect in this recruiting class, my guess is we will get one of these three Guiton, McHargue or Ros.

    RB
    Johnny (BO) Williams - R. Soph
    Robinson - Junior
    Schwartz - R. Freshman

    Incoming - Blankenship, White
    Losses - Scales, Bass, Harris, Thompson
    In my opinion, Scales career has been destroyed by injury, Bass has shown flashes of the type of player we expected, but no consistency, and Harris and Thompson were role players. We will replace Scales, Harris and Bass with the likes of Williams, White and Blankenship. I think this position is stable.

    WR
    Johnson - Soph
    Darks - Soph.
    Jones - Senior
    Range - R. Freshman
    Hamilton - Senior
    Carlson - Senior

    Incoming - Beshears, Lenz
    Losses - Sumrall, Messiah, Franklin
    Based on early indications, Darks and Johnson are the real deals, Jones has stepped up big time and Hamilton has been MIA but we know what he's capable of - big time plays. Considering Lonzie Range WILL play next year, mark my words, he will be two years back from his ACL and this kid is going to be a stud for us. We lose Sumrall which is huge right now, but, i think we can find another possession receiver, Sumrall has caught a couple TD's but he's not the deep threat that we already have at the position. Hoping either Beshears or Lenz will make an immediate impact on special teams.

    TE
    Catlett - Senior
    Franklin - Junior
    Hammerschmidt - R. Freshman

    Incoming: Boffeli (if he stays at TE)
    Lose - Blaes

    Not really sure about TE - we've had to keep them in on so many passing plays, not really sure of what the talent level is for these guys. Seen a lot of posts about Franklin being the man, but, have yet to see it on the field. I would not be surprised to see Hamilton at this position next year, i think he could exploit the LB coverage with his size and speed.

    OL
    Next Years Front Five
    Hicks (R. Soph), Stephens (Senior), Knapp (Senior), KO (R. Soph), Lamaak (R. Junior) **Haughton is in the mix somewhere, i just don't know where. I know i've heard a lot of haters out there, but i would love to see Haughton move to DT - i think he would be a beast on that side of the ball and his size and athleticism also projects very well at the next level. Now should ISU get Carpenter, i think he would possibly slide right into that Left Tackle Spot very nicely.

    Depth: Alvarez, Baysinger, Burris, Haughton, Hulbert, Klerekoper not to mention our incoming class (Lichtenberg) that will be redshirted.
    Loses: Johnson, Dedrick, Vanstrom, Slobidsky
    Dedrick will be missed, but, thats not to say the replacement is that far off his current play. We have been getting a lot of backside pressure, thats dedricks side to control. Hopefully someone can step in and control the position for two-three years. The depth and competition along the line is hopefully creating more depth and better players. IMO this is the one position that has not lived up to billing thus far. Hopefully, the shake up of the line will get players making plays along the front.

    From the aspects of talent, i think we have some seriously talented players currently playing but also for the future. I think the offense has to become a bit creative on how you use your athletes (Or not use i.e. Bates). There are so many variations of the spread offense that has many different ways to get the plays into the playmakers hands, there are other routes besides the bubble screen!!!!

    If our line gels, this offense could be tough to stop, we have talent - no doubt about it. We just need to use it more wisely, give our players with the talent the opportunity to showcase it. Plus that helps big time with recruiting!!!!


    Last edited by KMAC_ATTACK; 10-24-2008 at 12:09 PM.

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    Re: Rationalizing 2008 and beyond

    Looks good, but unfortunately Hicks has played so he'll be a junior next season. Hopefully we win tomorrow so we aren't looking forward to next season quite yet. ;)



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    Re: Rationalizing 2008 and beyond

    Good summary of next year's roster on Offense, KMAC.

    Like Bryce, I am not looking past this season yet, but it is nice to see how things will shape up next season.

    Also, Virgin is another potential recruit at QB.



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    Re: Rationalizing 2008 and beyond

    Good write up. Can tell it took some time. I just would want to wait to see what happens with the roster for next year. You never what can happen between the end of the current season and next season.

    I also don't want to completley give up on this year either. We haven't done as well as people had hoped, but there are 5 more games left. I'm not ready to check out yet.


    I don't drink the Kool-Aid, and I am done making excuses. Only keeping it real...

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    Re: Rationalizing 2008 and beyond

    Quote Originally Posted by KMAC_ATTACK View Post
    Haughton is in the mix somewhere, i just don't know where. I know i've heard a lot of haters out there, but i would love to see Haughton move to DT - i think he would be a beast on that side of the ball and his size and athleticism also projects very well at the next level.
    Do I have to be a "hater" to disagree, and think that Haughton is even more desperately needed on the offensive side of the ball--and even better suited for the NFL there?

    Don't forget Darius "Money" Reynolds, he could add a lot to the offense.



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    Re: Rationalizing 2008 and beyond

    sorry. can't help myself. Don't you think Bates could have gotten a first down or two in the second half of that Kansas game? Thanks. I feel better already.



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    Re: Rationalizing 2008 and beyond

    Quote Originally Posted by Aclone View Post
    Do I have to be a "hater" to disagree, and think that Haughton is even more desperately needed on the offensive side of the ball--and even better suited for the NFL there?

    Don't forget Darius "Money" Reynolds, he could add a lot to the offense.
    No - ACLONE its all good....No from our previous discussions, i simply had hoped thats were he would end up. I still think on our defense, call me crazy but if we think our offensive has played poorly, i cant believe anyone would say the Dline has played much better. We're 94 out 119 division 1 schools in rush defense. I know the linebackers have a part in that, but, if our dline is not eating up blockers, that allows them to release and jack up the LB....

    Don't care either offense or defense, but if he goes to the OL who sits???? Stephens? I think Haughton is more of a NFL guard then a Tackle, what do you think?

    Trust me i haven't forgotten about Money - i truly hopes he sees how he could come in and right away make an impact. But, with him now saying he has a top five, i thought previously he had said he had a top three. Its expanding, thats not good for us imo.

    I hope we get him, but i like his size and speed out wide - a serious homerun threat every time he touches the ball - a bit cocky imo, which is good!!! I think Bo will bring that to the table as well - creates an edge, a swagger, confidence breeds confidence, our team needs that swagger.



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    Re: Rationalizing 2008 and beyond

    Quote Originally Posted by KMAC_ATTACK View Post
    Based on early indications, Darks and Johnson are the real deals, Jones has stepped up big time and Hamilton has been MIA but we know what he's capable of - big time plays.
    In the last 20 years, I don't know that ISU has had the real deal at WR and that is why I think your judgment is clouded (no offense). Who was the last WR to make it in the NFL? Todd Blythe looked like he might be the real deal as a freshman and sophomore, but he was too skinny for the NFL and never did anything about it (or he did all he could do and it just wan't meant to be). I look at some of the other underclassmen in the Big 12 (Crabtree, Bryant, Briscoe, Maclin, etc.) and Darks and Johnson just aren't even close to being in their class. These guys are all sophomores now and we knew they were studs as freshman. It doesn't mean that Darks and Johnson can't develop into great WRs because I think they can if they dedicate themselves to it. I am excited about the playing time that Darks and Johnson are getting because I think it bodes well for the future. I hope we can get Money to come here too because we are still a long long ways from being stacked at WR.



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    Re: Rationalizing 2008 and beyond

    Quote Originally Posted by KMAC_ATTACK View Post
    We're 94 out 119 division 1 schools in rush defense.
    Chizik said weeks ago that rush defense is predicated in the defensive tackle/middle linebacker triumvirate, and even without considering Jesse Smith, all of his defensive tackles, even the seniors, are vastly inexperienced. Tate didn't play last year, Wier barely, Frere hardly at all, Johnson a bit more (but he's been hurt), Alburtis not at all, Black redshirted, and Ruempolhamer was in high school.

    So from those comments I'll assume that it's not an issue of talent, but of experience. And there's only one way to get experience, right?

    Don't care either offense or defense, but if he goes to the OL who sits???? Stephens? I think Haughton is more of a NFL guard then a Tackle, what do you think?
    Where does the proverbial 500lb gorilla sit? You know the answer to this one.

    And Haughton doesn't have to play where he would in the NFL. Besides, depth and flexibility are a GOOD thing.

    But, with him now saying he has a top five, i thought previously he had said he had a top three. Its expanding, thats not good for us imo.
    Just because a player wants to take five visits doesn't actually mean that he has a true top five.



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    Re: Rationalizing 2008 and beyond

    Quote Originally Posted by StLouisClone View Post
    In the last 20 years, I don't know that ISU has had the real deal at WR and that is why I think your judgment is clouded (no offense). Who was the last WR to make it in the NFL? Todd Blythe looked like he might be the real deal as a freshman and sophomore, but he was too skinny for the NFL and never did anything about it (or he did all he could do and it just wan't meant to be). I look at some of the other underclassmen in the Big 12 (Crabtree, Bryant, Briscoe, Maclin, etc.) and Darks and Johnson just aren't even close to being in their class. These guys are all sophomores now and we knew they were studs as freshman. It doesn't mean that Darks and Johnson can't develop into great WRs because I think they can if they dedicate themselves to it. I am excited about the playing time that Darks and Johnson are getting because I think it bodes well for the future. I hope we can get Money to come here too because we are still a long long ways from being stacked at WR.
    A few of those guys you mentioned also redshirted, and are playing on teams with running games, experienced quarterbacks, and offensive lines capable of providing ample time to those QB's. WR is the one unit I'm really not all that worried about.



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    Re: Rationalizing 2008 and beyond

    Quote Originally Posted by IowaGrantCY View Post
    sorry. can't help myself. Don't you think Bates could have gotten a first down or two in the second half of that Kansas game? Thanks. I feel better already.
    You could say the same thing for the Baylor and Nebraska game. If AA is hurt and cannot throw deep because of his hurt shoulder or rotator cuff, he is hampered physically. Our offense probably needs 400 yards to make it a game Saturday - 250 yards passing and 150 yards rushing.


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    Re: Rationalizing 2008 and beyond

    I am reserving all my 2009 optimism until we are knee deep in football season in 2009.

    I know it's cathartic and second nature as Cyclone fans to speculate on future improvement, but lets not get ahead of ourselves here. I am invested in football tickets for upcoming games this weekend, CU and Mizzou and I want expect some modifications and improved effort this year to end the 2008 season on a positive note. I expect better football, and am not lowering those expectations now through November.



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    Re: Rationalizing 2008 and beyond

    Great list and thanks for taking the time to do that analysis.

    One you missed - Bykowski, the True Freshman TE from Minn. who has played this year a little bit.

    Biggest concern for the future is probably still the OL..... also I would like to see us not base our offense around that zone read play, unless it is actually working next year. Would like to see some faster developing running plays, especially if Williams and Schwartz are in the backfield, they are not scat backs meant to take shotgun hand offs deep in the backfield.



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    Re: Rationalizing 2008 and beyond

    Quote Originally Posted by StLouisClone View Post
    (Crabtree, Bryant, Briscoe, Maclin,.
    WOW St Louisy......

    I know the difference with which you speak, but, what do those four have in common.....

    Harrell, Bradford, Reesing, Danials.....Um only 4 of the top 10 qb's in the nation.....But i got the point.

    I never once indicated our WR position had NFL ready guys, all i said is they're the real deal. We recruited them as 3-4* wide receivers and for the most part, they have played well considering we have ZERO running game and our offensive play calling has generated only a handful of plays longer then 7 yards. I watched Darks a lot during the Nebraska game, and even when he didnt get the ball, there were several times where he had created either separation or was open in the zones. I like our wr but add in there a guy like money reynolds and our wr position has some serious talent to compete at the highest level in my opinion. If Lonzie Range can make the adjustment, ESPN had him rated higher then Darks and just below Sedrick, and thats not even being able to evaluate him as a wide receiver. Said he was extremely fluid athlete with top end speed that will win footraces. To me, those are the guys that we need with the ball.

    We need the line to start everything off - if they can control the front, either AA or Tiller will make plays - i'm sure of that. And with the infusion of Williams at the RB position, we have all the tools on the offensive side of the ball, the weapons are in place to compete. TO COMPETE - NOT DOMINATE, please don't misunderstand the verbage....Its about getting to the point of competing in the BIG 12 and then the next step is refining it into a winner.



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    Re: Rationalizing 2008 and beyond

    Not sure about this but I don't think Carlson has played at all this year. Is he redshirting or just on the bench all the time? If he his RS'ing then that would make him still a junior next season.


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