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  1. #1
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    The Rays aren't a joke anymore

    How these low budget teams ever put together a team that can compete with the likes of the Yankees and the Red Sox is beyond me. If the Devil Rays can win the division, darn well anything should be possible.


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    Re: The Rays aren't a joke anymore

    Money can buy you talent but not necessarily the determination to win or the toughness necessary to compete for 162 games. The Yankees have had the highest payroll in baseball for what, ever?, and they have cheesed it for years.

    I would be very surprised to see Tampa keep pace over the second half of the season, but I'll be thrilled if they can take down Boston or New York. Their fans need to shut up for awhile and the rest of the country should see coverage of other baseball teams besides the Red Sox and Yankees. Though I imagine if Tampa made it to the WS, ESPN would spend half the time talking about how either Boston or New York didn't get there and why.



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    Re: The Rays aren't a joke anymore

    Teams like the Marlins, Rays, Twins and A's have directly benefited from the greed of the high spending teams. They have been raking in top draft picks and minor league talent for years, it was only a matter of time when they would all get to the bigs and things would click. MLB has figured out a pretty good system to create parity with the compensation pick system. Unfortunately for some other low budget teams, they haven't figured out how to take advantage of it.

    Teams like Florida, Tampa, and Minnesota may not spend alot of money on their payroll, but they invest heavily in draft signing bonuses, scouting, and player development.



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    Re: The Rays aren't a joke anymore

    Please take it easy on the Red Sox. I've been a Red Sox fan all of my life and the first 40 years have been miserable. I worshiped Yaz, Petrocelli, Conigliario, etc. when I was growing up. I'm finially getting to enjoy my just rewards!

    I'm hoping the Cyclones will hit the promise land in my lifetime as well.



  5. #5
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    Re: The Rays aren't a joke anymore

    IMO - in baseball, more than any other pro sport blurs the lines between the talented vs. the less talented because you arent directly going head to head against each other like football, basketball etc. THere are a lot more variables involved that allow the lesser talented team a greater chance at success than another sport like football.


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    Re: The Rays aren't a joke anymore

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Architect View Post
    IMO - in baseball, more than any other pro sport blurs the lines between the talented vs. the less talented because you arent directly going head to head against each other like football, basketball etc. THere are a lot more variables involved that allow the lesser talented team a greater chance at success than another sport like football.
    I don't consider myself a baseball expert, but it would seem like if you could "buy" a starting four pitching staff that is among the best that you would dominate.


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  7. #7
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    Re: The Rays aren't a joke anymore

    Quote Originally Posted by alaskaguy View Post
    I don't consider myself a baseball expert, but it would seem like if you could "buy" a starting four pitching staff that is among the best that you would dominate.
    Having good pitching is a big help, but you still need to score runs and also have a defense that does not commit errors. All a pitcher can do is try to keep it close.



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    Re: The Rays aren't a joke anymore

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Architect View Post
    IMO - in baseball, more than any other pro sport blurs the lines between the talented vs. the less talented because you arent directly going head to head against each other like football, basketball etc. THere are a lot more variables involved that allow the lesser talented team a greater chance at success than another sport like football.
    Don't kid yourself on the Rays, they are evrey bit as 'talented' as the Yankees and Sox, they just haven't had time to become 'names'.

    Quote Originally Posted by alaskaguy View Post
    I don't consider myself a baseball expert, but it would seem like if you could "buy" a starting four pitching staff that is among the best that you would dominate.
    The problem with this argument is the players are still a bit ahead of the owners. They are getting owners to commit to these LONG 6-7 year contracts which are turning out to be HUGE risks. Instead of committing to these, the lower budget teams are getting 2-4 players every bit as 'talented' and waiting for them to develop.



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    Re: The Rays aren't a joke anymore

    Quote Originally Posted by cybsball20 View Post
    Teams like Florida, Tampa, and Minnesota may not spend alot of money on their payroll, but they invest heavily in draft signing bonuses, scouting, and player development.
    So why can't the big money teams do the same and invest heavily in scouting and player development?


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  10. #10
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    Re: The Rays aren't a joke anymore

    Quote Originally Posted by cybsball20 View Post
    Don't kid yourself on the Rays, they are evrey bit as 'talented' as the Yankees and Sox, they just haven't had time to become 'names'.
    I wasn't. I'm saying that due to the nature of the game of a baseball, a last place team has a greater chance in any given day to beat the first place team when compared to football, basketball, etc. A pure athletic advantage over the opponent in baseball is not as big of an advantage in the other pro sports where the teams are directly facing off against each other on every play.


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  11. #11
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    Re: The Rays aren't a joke anymore

    Quote Originally Posted by cybsball20 View Post
    Teams like the Marlins, Rays, Twins and A's have directly benefited from the greed of the high spending teams. They have been raking in top draft picks and minor league talent for years, it was only a matter of time when they would all get to the bigs and things would click. MLB has figured out a pretty good system to create parity with the compensation pick system. Unfortunately for some other low budget teams, they haven't figured out how to take advantage of it.

    Teams like Florida, Tampa, and Minnesota may not spend alot of money on their payroll, but they invest heavily in draft signing bonuses, scouting, and player development.
    Because it wouldn't be a baseball discussion without mentioning steroids...

    I think the decline of some of these high payroll teams can be directly tied to the decline in the use of steroids. Steroids prolonged the careers of a lot of guys, making them highly productive in their later years. The high payroll teams could sign these older free players to big contracts, and be confident they'd stay productive. Meanwhile low payroll teams had to take their chances with younger cheaper guys. Now that steroid use is down, the older players are less productive and riskier, dragging down some of the higher payroll teams (e.g. Yankees, Mets). Meanwhile a lower payroll team that strikes it big with a few young superstars (Rays, Marlins) can blow past a team of aging superstars.



  12. #12
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    Re: The Rays aren't a joke anymore

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Architect View Post
    I wasn't. I'm saying that due to the nature of the game of a baseball, a last place team has a greater chance in any given day to beat the first place team when compared to football, basketball, etc. A pure athletic advantage over the opponent in baseball is not as big of an advantage in the other pro sports where the teams are directly facing off against each other on every play.
    Over one game, yes... Over 162 games, no way.



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  13. #13
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    Re: The Rays aren't a joke anymore

    Quote Originally Posted by alaskaguy View Post
    So why can't the big money teams do the same and invest heavily in scouting and player development?
    There is a formula that MLB uses to classify free agents. To use the Twins as an example, Torii Hunter was a "Type A" (highest type) free agent. That means that if Hunter signs with another team, then the Twins will get two compensatory draft picks. One is the first round pick of the team that signed him. This is a protected pick, however. I think that if it is in the top 10 or 15, then the team that signs him keeps their first round pick and surrenders their second round pick to the free agent's prior team.

    The team that lost a Type A free agent also receives a sandwich pick, a draft pick inbetween the first and second round.

    So teams with high payrolls could invest highly in scouting, signing bonuses, development, etc. But as long as they're signing stars from other teams, they're not going to be having their top draft picks.



  14. #14
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    Re: The Rays aren't a joke anymore

    The Red Sox have actually invested alot in their farm system the last few years, as have the Yankees, and they are starting to see some benefits, but as mwitt said, you get the picks by losing guys, not signing guys...



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  15. #15
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    Re: The Rays aren't a joke anymore

    Sweep... 3.5 game lead... I think the Sox are going to start looking for bullpen help immediately.



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