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  1. #91
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    Re: Task Force Recommendation for VEISHEA

    Quote Originally Posted by Scott34 View Post
    9

    You are really being selfish now. What's it going to take for you to realize that this has become a serious problem?
    No kidding.

    They've tried NUMEROUS things to make Veishea work, and yet it still hasn't worked. I don't know what else they can do?

    Anything that is called "VEISHEA" is going to be a problem IMO. Just that word makes students and others from outside of Ames think it's time to have a huge party on Welch Avenue and burn and destroy things. That is what that word has come to mean unfortunately.

    Ask anyone outside of ISU what VEISHEA is and that is what they will tell you. It's just a great big drunk fest where you can get totally out of control and have riots. That is what it has come to mean.

    And it's even gotten to the point where incoming students feel the need to live up the stereotype as well. "If you don't riot like we used to back in the day... then you aren't ****, and you don't know how to party like we did!". That's the attitude now. In fact, I think some feel the need to even outdo previous riots and wreck even more havoc.

    VEISHEA has lost all meaning unfortunately, and I don't think you can get it back now. Some things just stick with certain names. When you say "Richard Nixon" for instance, you instantly think "Watergate". Well.... when you say "VEISHEA" now, the first word people think of is "riots".

    It's VERY unfortunate, but it's reality.



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    Re: Task Force Recommendation for VEISHEA

    Quote Originally Posted by Tornado man View Post
    I agree - what did this "task force" do besides meet periodically and talk around the table?
    1. Did they contact other universities with similar problems and what, if any, solutions were arrived at?
    2. Did they talk with Ames police personnel (not the chief, but actual patrolmen/women) and ISU security about what they would do?
    3. Did they address the root cause of the riots/unrest - which is what their charge from Leach was?
    Appears to be a lazy, superficial group to me. What "digging" into the issues did they actually do?
    Seems like it was a predestined group sanctioned to kill off VEISHA. Oh well, let's see how many beer parties in the spring next year.


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  3. #93
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    Re: Task Force Recommendation for VEISHEA

    Quote Originally Posted by clonedude View Post
    No kidding.

    They've tried NUMEROUS things to make Veishea work, and yet it still hasn't worked. I don't know what else they can do?

    Anything that is called "VEISHEA" is going to be a problem IMO. Just that word makes students and others from outside of Ames think it's time to have a huge party on Welch Avenue and burn and destroy things. That is what that word has come to mean unfortunately.

    Ask anyone outside of ISU what VEISHEA is and that is what they will tell you. It's just a great big drunk fest where you can get totally out of control and have riots. That is what it has come to mean.

    And it's even gotten to the point where incoming students feel the need to live up the stereotype as well. "If you don't riot like we used to back in the day... then you aren't ****, and you don't know how to party like we did!". That's the attitude now. In fact, I think some feel the need to even outdo previous riots and wreck even more havoc.

    VEISHEA has lost all meaning unfortunately, and I don't think you can get it back now. Some things just stick with certain names. When you say "Richard Nixon" for instance, you instantly think "Watergate". Well.... when you say "VEISHEA" now, the first word people think of is "riots".

    It's VERY unfortunate, but it's reality.
    Couldn't disagree more. You're focusing on the actions of a few knuckleheads that got out of control in 04 and this year, and of course the media played that to the max. But I'd say Veishea to most ISU alums means a spring celebration of ISU filled with a lot of great campus activities, and possibly a return to the old campus to revive old memories and enjoy the current students. For Iowans it's a great opportunity for Iowa high school kids to get a good look at ISU and find out what it has to offer. To thousands of central Iowans it's highlighted by the parade where they can take their kids and grandkids to enjoy the parade and walking around the beautiful campus. Defining Veishea by the actions of the occasional knuckleheads is way off imo.



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    Re: Task Force Recommendation for VEISHEA

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Janny View Post
    Why? Because VEISHEA just isn't worth it. There are about a hundred other ways I'd rather have my tax dollars spent than on extra police training and personnel for a silly festival that the students can't handle.
    Even with any damage that has been caused over the years, i'd wager that nearly every business in ames would disagree with this, especially all the hotels and restaurants that were consistently filled veishea weekend.



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    Re: Task Force Recommendation for VEISHEA

    Quote Originally Posted by CYKOFAN View Post
    Couldn't disagree more. You're focusing on the actions of a few knuckleheads that got out of control in 04 and this year, and of course the media played that to the max. But I'd say Veishea to most ISU alums means a spring celebration of ISU filled with a lot of great campus activities, and possibly a return to the old campus to revive old memories and enjoy the current students. For Iowans it's a great opportunity for Iowa high school kids to get a good look at ISU and find out what it has to offer. To thousands of central Iowans it's highlighted by the parade where they can take their kids and grandkids to enjoy the parade and walking around the beautiful campus. Defining Veishea by the actions of the occasional knuckleheads is way off imo.
    There's the disconnect. VEISHEA, as it is defined connotatively today, is not a celebration of the University. It's not viewed as cherry pies, campus organizations, and parades anymore to anybody not connected with the University. It's seen as on-campus concerts, off-campus house parties, and a time to get really hammered. That isn't going to change until the association of VEISHEA = city-wide, out of control party is dead to those outside of Ames and the University. Best way to do that is to kill off all of it as it is known today. If you keep anything VEISHEA like in the spring, the association will never go away.


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    Re: Task Force Recommendation for VEISHEA

    Quote Originally Posted by clonedude View Post
    No kidding.

    They've tried NUMEROUS things to make Veishea work, and yet it still hasn't worked. I don't know what else they can do?

    Well one of the problems is they had many recommendations after 04, but over 10 years they went back to same old same old.

    The problems arent going to go away without veishea either. The campustown area is getting more and more densely populated with more and more multi-story buildings going up. Veishea or not, within the next 10 years i bet there's another 'disturbance' in the spring when the weather is nice and a bunch of people decide they want to be outside and drinking.



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    Re: Task Force Recommendation for VEISHEA

    Quote Originally Posted by cloneswereall View Post
    There's the disconnect. VEISHEA, as it is defined connotatively today, is not a celebration of the University. It's not viewed as cherry pies, campus organizations, and parades anymore to anybody not connected with the University. It's seen as on-campus concerts, off-campus house parties, and a time to get really hammered. That isn't going to change until the association of VEISHEA = city-wide, out of control party is dead to those outside of Ames and the University. Best way to do that is to kill off all of it as it is known today. If you keep anything VEISHEA like in the spring, the association will never go away.
    Question, do you think isu is the only university that has a spring or fall celebration? If not, why didn't this task force talk to officials from say Penn State, Indiana U, Wisconson, KState, Illinois, Purdue, etc? These are all schools off the top of my head that have celebrations yearly that have problems and sometimes even more than just two riots in the last decade. I'm not excusing the behavior as I was up there that night and walked home embarrassed. And yes the students who were idiots need to pay the consequences, hence why it needs to be disbanded for a few years. But the overreaction is astounding, and this task force for the most part was just a facade for Tom Hill.



  8. #98
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    Re: Task Force Recommendation for VEISHEA

    Quote Originally Posted by alarson View Post
    Even with any damage that has been caused over the years, i'd wager that nearly every business in ames would disagree with this, especially all the hotels and restaurants that were consistently filled veishea weekend.
    The business owners aren't the only ones paying taxes, so I honestly don't care much. Most are big chains benefitting that have corporate offices elsewhere.


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  9. #99
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    Re: Task Force Recommendation for VEISHEA

    Quote Originally Posted by alarson View Post
    Well one of the problems is they had many recommendations after 04, but over 10 years they went back to same old same old.

    The problems arent going to go away without veishea either. The campustown area is getting more and more densely populated with more and more multi-story buildings going up. Veishea or not, within the next 10 years i bet there's another 'disturbance' in the spring when the weather is nice and a bunch of people decide they want to be outside and drinking.
    Just curious, but why don't any of these things happen during Homecoming, or one of the first few weeks of fall term, or during the weekend of any home football game? Hell, why doesn't this happen at UNI or Iowa the first few nice weekends in the spring? My guess is it's because there aren't associations of causing a ruckus the third week of September like there is during VEISHEA week.


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  10. #100
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    Re: Task Force Recommendation for VEISHEA

    Quote Originally Posted by cloneswereall View Post
    There's the disconnect. VEISHEA, as it is defined connotatively today, is not a celebration of the University. It's not viewed as cherry pies, campus organizations, and parades anymore to anybody not connected with the University. It's seen as on-campus concerts, off-campus house parties, and a time to get really hammered. That isn't going to change until the association of VEISHEA = city-wide, out of control party is dead to those outside of Ames and the University. Best way to do that is to kill off all of it as it is known today. If you keep anything VEISHEA like in the spring, the association will never go away.
    Obviously I don't agree with that but I'm an older alum and maybe Veishea is becoming to mean "party" to a lot of the younger Iowan's, thanks in no small part I'm sure to the way the media has played up what I would call the mini-riots in 04 and this year. Then why not a very public campaign on the part of the university to emphasize the many good activities and real meaning of what Veishea should be, or at least used to mean if the perception has changed that much. And of course beefing up security and finding out how other campuses deal with major partying would be a priority. Just can't see giving in to some very drunk people that occasionally have been allowed to get completely out of control.



  11. #101
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    Re: Task Force Recommendation for VEISHEA

    Quote Originally Posted by cloneswereall View Post
    Just curious, but why don't any of these things happen during Homecoming, or one of the first few weeks of fall term, or during the weekend of any home football game? Hell, why doesn't this happen at UNI or Iowa the first few nice weekends in the spring? My guess is it's because there aren't associations of causing a ruckus the third week of September like there is during VEISHEA week.
    Have you been in Ames the night of homecoming? Or say even iowa-isu recently or the okie state game in 2011?

    something like this could happen just as easily those nights as it did during VEISHEA this past year. I've actually seen in the past years, not just sitting behind a computer.



  12. #102
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    Re: Task Force Recommendation for VEISHEA

    Quote Originally Posted by CyDude16 View Post
    Question, do you think isu is the only university that has a spring or fall celebration? If not, why didn't this task force talk to officials from say Penn State, Indiana U, Wisconson, KState, Illinois, Purdue, etc? These are all schools off the top of my head that have celebrations yearly that have problems and sometimes even more than just two riots in the last decade. I'm not excusing the behavior as I was up there that night and walked home embarrassed. And yes the students who were idiots need to pay the consequences, hence why it needs to be disbanded for a few years. But the overreaction is astounding, and this task force for the most part was just a facade for Tom Hill.
    One: No, I don't believe ISU is the only school that has a celebration. Two: do we know for a fact that the task force didn't talk to those schools? Three: You say those schools still have problems with those celebrations, so why would their advice on how to handle it be good? Four: If you really want to kill off an association with something, the moves you make need to be drastic. There needs to be a point where a line in the sand is drawn, and it's been drawn before but behavior hasn't changed. At that point, the problem just needs to be done with for the foreseeable future (where we are today). Everyone has seen how VEISHEA has been reprimanded before, and there have been warnings in the past about getting rid of it completely. If you keep threatening to do something, and never do it, nothing is going to change. This year was just the straw that broke the camel's back.


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  13. #103
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    Re: Task Force Recommendation for VEISHEA

    Quote Originally Posted by CyDude16 View Post
    Have you been in Ames the night of homecoming? Or say even iowa-isu recently or the okie state game in 2011?

    something like this could happen just as easily those nights as it did during VEISHEA this past year. I've actually seen in the past years, not just sitting behind a computer.
    Yes, yes, no.

    Why didn't those things happen then? The association of causing destruction isn't there.


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    Re: Task Force Recommendation for VEISHEA

    Quote Originally Posted by clonedude View Post
    No kidding.

    They've tried NUMEROUS things to make Veishea work, and yet it still hasn't worked. I don't know what else they can do?

    Anything that is called "VEISHEA" is going to be a problem IMO. Just that word makes students and others from outside of Ames think it's time to have a huge party on Welch Avenue and burn and destroy things. That is what that word has come to mean unfortunately.

    Ask anyone outside of ISU what VEISHEA is and that is what they will tell you. It's just a great big drunk fest where you can get totally out of control and have riots. That is what it has come to mean.

    And it's even gotten to the point where incoming students feel the need to live up the stereotype as well. "If you don't riot like we used to back in the day... then you aren't ****, and you don't know how to party like we did!". That's the attitude now. In fact, I think some feel the need to even outdo previous riots and wreck even more havoc.

    VEISHEA has lost all meaning unfortunately, and I don't think you can get it back now. Some things just stick with certain names. When you say "Richard Nixon" for instance, you instantly think "Watergate". Well.... when you say "VEISHEA" now, the first word people think of is "riots".

    It's VERY unfortunate, but it's reality.
    I agree that VEISHEA has turned out to be that in the minds of those 15-30 of age. I disagree though that the damage has to be permanent. With a decent hiatus and actual effective change, it could be salvaged.

    And quit with the "they've tried everything" bs, show me one thing they tried that anyone thought would 've been anywhere effective before put in place. They were all bad changes made to say "hey we did something" without putting real thought into it, quick fixes never work. (Like an overweight girl thinking she''ll do the 30 day ab challenge a month before a wedding and lose 10 inches off their waste). I agree this task force was put together to kill it so nobody had to actually put effort into fixing it as it would be a huge challenge.

    This is like any other cf debate, people on different sides of the fence that won't be convinced. Except people against it don't listen to the other side when shown that what was tried in the way to fix it is bs.

    I do agree though that it's a big problem, the event needs to die for a bit, and go over some major changes on how to handle the night time drinking. The whole event shouldn't be scrapped for the few that ruin it.



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    Re: Task Force Recommendation for VEISHEA

    Quote Originally Posted by cloneswereall View Post
    Yes, yes, no.

    Why didn't those things happen then? The association of causing destruction isn't there.
    I agree. It doesn't mean though the association couldn't be changed over time. Difficult task? Extremely. Worth it, I seem to think so, but who knows.



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