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  1. #136
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    Re: If we fire Messingham what type of OC could we get?

    Quote Originally Posted by norcalcy View Post
    Just for fun, what if CPR called and asked YOU to come in and coach the O this week. What would you do? Here's my emergency fix

    1. Call the entire O into the meeting room and ceremoniously dump the binder with the current "scheme" into the largest trash can I could find
    2. Hand out a laminated legal sized page with about 10 plays on it. A sampling: iso run with Jeff Woody lead blocking, some kind of toss sweep, a short passing game with shallow crossing routes for Ecby, Daley and the TE. Streak route for Bundrage down the middle (not against the boundary where a perfect back shoulder throw is required). Tunnel screen that actually sets up with some blockers. NO zone read. NO sideways throws to the boundary.
    3. Head to the practice field and practice our new skinny playbook until we see what we're supposed to do in our sleep.
    4. Pull the quarterbacks out from underneath the bus and get the weight of the world off their shoulders
    5. Tell everybody to loosen up and have fun. Nothing to lose.


    This is quite superficial and the experts will rip me to shreds (I've never coached on any level). However, I believe this approach, hokey as it is, could match the results of the last three weeks. Thoughts from others given the silly hypothetical I put out there? Might be a productive alternative to all the arguing.
    Can I please be the DC going up against that playbook? Pretty Please!!!



  2. #137
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    Re: If we fire Messingham what type of OC could we get?

    Quote Originally Posted by isufbcurt View Post
    Can I please be the DC going up against that playbook? Pretty Please!!!
    Is what coaches are saying now.



  3. #138
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    Re: If we fire Messingham what type of OC could we get?

    After this season who could JP afford to get with the credentials to replace this type of a Mess and bring the top tier talent we need to compete in the Big 12 and win. Sad at the beginning of the season there was a spark of enthusiasm with season ticket sales when JP was discussing future ideas/development of the South end zone. How many years will that get pushed back now.

    http://cyclonefanatic.com/forum/foot...ld-we-get.html



  4. #139
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    Re: If we fire Messingham what type of OC could we get?

    Quote Originally Posted by isufbcurt View Post
    Can I please be the DC going up against that playbook? Pretty Please!!!
    Good point. But, on some level, complexity can be the enemy as well. Doesn't it ultimately come down to you against your guy? KISS principle works in a lot of walks of life, why not here?



  5. #140
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    Re: If we fire Messingham what type of OC could we get?

    Quote Originally Posted by norcalcy View Post
    Good point. But, on some level, complexity can be the enemy as well. Doesn't it ultimately come down to you against your guy? KISS principle works in a lot of walks of life, why not here?
    This isn't 1985 anymore. Bashing into the line of scrimmage and then running a waggle off play action doesn't work anymore. Coaches are more in tune with matchups of speed/space than they have been. They are willing to let you have that "3 yards in a cloud of dust" because they have come to realize that an offense cannot function that way. It isn't a race to 15 points anymore. It's a race to 40 or even more. Defense isn't about getting stops, it's about limiting damage. Consequently, offense is about cutting other teams apart. Bill Walsh was thought to be an offensive innovator. He isn't half the offensive football mind of Leach, Kelly, Meyer, Rodriguez and all of these guys who have designed offenses that not only out-execute you but make at least one defender wrong on a regular basis in the run game. Football is so much more complex than it used to be. You can use KSU. They run that run/pass option play and it has now developed throughout the season. Teams run packaged plays. Teams can literally do 4 different things out of one play call. The teams that aren't complex are teams that, physcially, are better. Alabama has better players than you no matter who you are. They run a vanilla offense because their line can handle yours on both sides and they are bigger than you on both sides all while being faster.


    It's all snark from here on out

  6. #141
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    Re: If we fire Messingham what type of OC could we get?

    Quote Originally Posted by norcalcy View Post
    Good point. But, on some level, complexity can be the enemy as well. Doesn't it ultimately come down to you against your guy? KISS principle works in a lot of walks of life, why not here?
    Wasn't this the selling point on Mess after Herman left? I seem to remember talks of "scaling down the playbook" and "simplifying the playbook" and so on and so forth.



  7. #142
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    Re: If we fire Messingham what type of OC could we get?

    Quote Originally Posted by proisu View Post
    SO, what is common denominator ?
    I don't know. Who has been around the entire time? CPR, Messingham, Bleil, Pollard, Yancy.



  8. #143
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    Re: If we fire Messingham what type of OC could we get?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tre4ISU View Post
    This isn't 1985 anymore. Bashing into the line of scrimmage and then running a waggle off play action doesn't work anymore. Coaches are more in tune with matchups of speed/space than they have been. They are willing to let you have that "3 yards in a cloud of dust" because they have come to realize that an offense cannot function that way. It isn't a race to 15 points anymore. It's a race to 40 or even more. Defense isn't about getting stops, it's about limiting damage. Consequently, offense is about cutting other teams apart. Bill Walsh was thought to be an offensive innovator. He isn't half the offensive football mind of Leach, Kelly, Meyer, Rodriguez and all of these guys who have designed offenses that not only out-execute you but make at least one defender wrong on a regular basis in the run game. Football is so much more complex than it used to be. You can use KSU. They run that run/pass option play and it has now developed throughout the season. Teams run packaged plays. Teams can literally do 4 different things out of one play call. The teams that aren't complex are teams that, physcially, are better. Alabama has better players than you no matter who you are. They run a vanilla offense because their line can handle yours on both sides and they are bigger than you on both sides all while being faster.
    Andy Reid and several other disciples of the West Coast Offense beg to differ. Bill has departed the Earth so I don't know how much more he would have evolved his offensive thinking relative to Leach and the others. But in the history of offensive geniuses, I think he still stacks up pretty well and an amazing amount of what he developed is still relevant in the game.



  9. #144
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    Re: If we fire Messingham what type of OC could we get?

    Quote Originally Posted by norcalcy View Post
    Andy Reid and several other disciples of the West Coast Offense beg to differ. Bill has departed the Earth so I don't know how much more he would have evolved his offensive thinking relative to Leach and the others. But in the history of offensive geniuses, I think he still stacks up pretty well and an amazing amount of what he developed is still relevant in the game.
    Don't get that comment wrong, Walsh was a great mind but if you look at his tree, a lot of those guys are fading out, save Reid, who is relying on defense right now anyway. I should have explained better. My point was that those guys developed systems that create easy production. They get guys open, they take a defender out of the play, they basically manufacture mistakes. There's a reason the West Coast offense isn't used much in college football. It requires better execution at relatively difficult tasks to succeed. Those guys i mentioned took teams that maybe didn't have the best individual players but through misdirection, option football, and other things that force a defense into "cheating," for lack of a better term, they have put together very good offenses. That's what you need to do at Iowa State and really 90 percent of schools. I'm also a Michigan fan. They want to run a version of the WCO. They can't. They suck at it and are, at times worse than us. At times they are much better. When are they much better? When they have a distinct talent advantage. Otherwise, they aren't much better than ISU. The Oline has to be very good and the QB has to be an extremely good decision maker and thrower.


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