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  1. #1
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    Are we better off?

    So a friend of mine and I were talking at church yesterday. He mentioned that he and another friend of his believe that we are no better off now then we were with McCarney. I get it, he is very frustrated. In fact after going to Memphis, he decided he is done buying football tickets until he sees a better product. To that I said that I wish others felt that way so that my tickets don't keep going up, and my parking doesn't get further away from the stadium. (Although I love seeing the stadium full for all of these games)

    So I did some very minimal research, (Wikipedia):
    McCarney's records 56-86 and 27-68
    Overall 39.7 Win%
    Conference 28 Win%

    New facilities:
    -Jacobsen
    -Bergstrom
    -Natural Field
    -Press Box

    Rhoads' records 25-31 and 12-24
    Overall 44.6 Win%
    Conf 33 Win%

    New Facilities
    -Football Only Facility
    -Video board
    -Suites/Concourses
    -Cafeteria in Jacobsen
    -Season ticket sales outselling total tickets during previous regimes. Why? Because gameday is SO MUCH BETTER now than ever before. Not just because of the video board, but the product on the field is in almost every game now.

    I don't have the time or motivation to research strength of schedule over these seasons. Nor do I know the point spreads of wins and losses, but I think you would find big disparities here as well.

    Believe me, I'm a huge McCarney fan, so this isn't bashing him. I'm trying to point out why most of us believe in CPR and what his staff is accomplishing here. We'll see what happens with the offensive staff after this year.

    What do you guys say? Are we way better off, just a bit better off, or just the same?


    Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and to remove all doubt. Abraham Lincoln's version of Proverbs 17:28

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    Re: Are we better off?

    Yes, we are better off. Strength of schedule would show a lot. Remember, we also had the North and South back then as well.



  3. #3
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    Re: Are we better off?

    Yes....

    Is your friend named TornadoMan by chance?



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    Re: Are we better off?

    I dont think its easy to compare the two. Mccarney got to compete under the 8 game conference schedule that avoided half of the south teams and got to feast on a relatively weak big 12 north.

    And yes, the environment is a hell of a lot better, but thats been a buildup that started under mccarney, and has been led in large part by pollard as well, and rhoads' upsets have helped as well. A lot of joint credit for that.



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    Re: Are we better off?

    First 5 years

    DM - 13-42
    PR - 25-31 (Against Stiffer competition)

    Yes we are better off.


    #TeamProhm #ProhmanEmpire #ProhmanColiseum

    @RedDirtCyclone

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    Re: Are we better off?

    Did you see how many people were in the stands for the last few games in the McCarney era??? Probably not because I almost had my whole section to myself.... Enough said...


    Bellzisu is aka Chris Bellcock. Just so I'm not anonymous anymore.

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    Re: Are we better off?

    Quote Originally Posted by stateofmind View Post
    So a friend of mine and I were talking at church yesterday. He mentioned that he and another friend of his believe that we are no better off now then we were with McCarney. I get it, he is very frustrated. In fact after going to Memphis, he decided he is done buying football tickets until he sees a better product. To that I said that I wish others felt that way so that my tickets don't keep going up, and my parking doesn't get further away from the stadium. (Although I love seeing the stadium full for all of these games)

    So I did some very minimal research, (Wikipedia):
    McCarney's records 56-86 and 27-68
    Overall 39.7 Win%
    Conference 28 Win%

    New facilities:
    -Jacobsen
    -Bergstrom
    -Natural Field
    -Press Box

    Rhoads' records 25-31 and 12-24
    Overall 44.6 Win%
    Conf 33 Win%

    New Facilities
    -Football Only Facility
    -Video board
    -Suites/Concourses
    -Cafeteria in Jacobsen
    -Season ticket sales outselling total tickets during previous regimes. Why? Because gameday is SO MUCH BETTER now than ever before. Not just because of the video board, but the product on the field is in almost every game now.

    I don't have the time or motivation to research strength of schedule over these seasons. Nor do I know the point spreads of wins and losses, but I think you would find big disparities here as well.

    Believe me, I'm a huge McCarney fan, so this isn't bashing him. I'm trying to point out why most of us believe in CPR and what his staff is accomplishing here. We'll see what happens with the offensive staff after this year.

    What do you guys say? Are we way better off, just a bit better off, or just the same?
    I shouldn't dignify this with a response, but anyone that believes that ISU is not better off now has not been following ISU football very long. Additionally, they do not remember the monumental struggle of Dan McCarney's first 5 years. Also, they do not remember the facilities back in those days (off season workouts were held in State Gym after Mac's first season for crying out loud). Finally, they also forget that we did not have crowds of 50,000+ for every home game (those were considered rare and very large crowds in those days) and they do not remember the pre-CGC days.

    ISU still faces a struggle in this conference and in this recruiting territory, but it isn't impossible to play winning football here. People should think about what they say and look at this team using reason rather than reactionary emotion.



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    Re: Are we better off?

    Also, we were getting blown out regularly in McCarney's days. We don't get blown out regularly today. Building a program like Iowa State takes time and takes baby steps.



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    Re: Are we better off?

    Programs like ISU cannot afford to prematurely pull the ripcord. If losses of 8, 6, 1, and 7 pts with a team riddled by injuries at several key positions is the bottom falling out for a Rhoads-coached team, sign me up for more. Beats the hell out of getting beat by 40 every game like ISU has been known to do in past seasons.



  10. #10
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    Re: Are we better off?

    Quote Originally Posted by stateofmind View Post

    What do you guys say? Are we way better off, just a bit better off, or just the same?
    I suppose it's all in your perspective but if you like making more money, having better facilities, winning more games and being generally more competitive you'd say we're way better off now.

    Now, if we go 1-11 this season and don't have a season that makes up for it in a big way next season we should all take a moment to take stock of where the program is at that point. But that would be at the end of the 2014 season...


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  11. #11
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    Re: Are we better off?

    Different era, different situation, different expectations, different facilities. We shouldn't be competing or measuring against what McCarney did or did not do. I don't put much stock into what was other than to note that the second half of the Earl Bruce tenure showed what is possible but not achieved in the last 35 years. Until we can win more and not finish at the bottom of the conference every year than better than yesterday or not better than yesterday doesn't mean squat.



  12. #12
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    Re: Are we better off?

    Check out this link and then ask if you think we are better off:

    Iowa State 2003 Schedule - Cyclones Home and Away - ESPN

    Or maybe this one:

    Iowa State 2006 Schedule - Cyclones Home and Away - ESPN

    We were regularly getting throttled week in and week out.



  13. #13
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    Re: Are we better off?

    Quote Originally Posted by BoxsterCy View Post
    Different era, different situation, different expectations, different facilities. We shouldn't be competing or measuring against what McCarney did or did not do. I don't put much stock into what was other than to note that the second half of the Earl Bruce tenure showed what is possible but not achieved in the last 35 years. Until we can win more and not finish at the bottom of the conference every year than better than yesterday or not better than yesterday doesn't mean squat.
    I'm glad you said this. Every Cyclones fan that say we can't _______ needs to have a look at EB's last three seasons and Bill Snyder's body of work.


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  14. #14
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    Re: Are we better off?

    I think we are way ahead of the DM years. I see much better depth and more playmakers on the roster. This WILL equate to wins sooner or later. Dan's Achilles heel was he could not capitalize on success IMHO. When he had a lead in a game he would curl up like a opossum. When he had winning seasons he could not improve recruiting. I do not see those flaws in CPR.



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    Re: Are we better off?

    Quote Originally Posted by weR138 View Post
    I'm glad you said this. Every Cyclones fan that say we can't _______ needs to have a look at EB's last three seasons and Bill Snyder's body of work.
    I don't think Rhoads is done showing what he can do with ISU. Schools like ISU are tough in that you could have a superstar for a coach and as soon as he moves on or retires, chances are that you won't be able to sustain success. Outside of his first year, OSU fans would say Earle Bruce failed there. Even with a determination to have a successful football program, KSU will likely fall back after Snyder retires.



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