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  1. #1
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    Conference expansion question

    So driving home tonight and listening to KGYM 1600 over here in eastern Iowa, the the Hawk Lovers, I mean the "radio personalities", were discussing the B1G Conference, of course, and it's possible further expansion.

    They were commenting that it's only a inevitable that the B1G Conference will eventually go to at least 16 teams, and possibly even 18 someday. They were discussing which schools they should add. The next 2 teams, after Rutgers and Maryland, they said should be Georgia Tech and Florida State possibly?

    Their reasoning is that with Rutgers they will be getting a ton of TV sets in New York City, and with Maryland they will get a lot of TV sets in the D.C. area. So going for Georgia Tech would give them the huge Atlanta metro area, and Florida State would help them get some TV sets in Florida as well.

    So I'm sitting there wondering to myself why in the world the Big 12 added WV and TCU? WV is in the middle of nowhere with very little TV sets. TCU doesn't expand the conference at all since we already had like a billion schools in Texas already. So why did we add these 2 schools?

    Thinking back, wouldn't we have been better off adding Louisville and Georgia Tech or something like that? Heck, I still wonder why we didn't go after BYU either? BYU would have added a lot of TV sets. Or even Memphis? But what kind of following do WV and TCU bring to the table?

    And going forward, if we must expand, I think we need to get into Florida somehow. Add Florida St and Miami or something?



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    Re: Conference expansion question

    If you remember back, the Big 12 was on the brink of collapse for the second year in a row. All ACC schools were off the table then as they should have been.

    Heck, we almost took Pitt, but when they heard the ACC invite was coming they ran there instead. Louisville by all accounts had an offer that they turned down because they didn't think much of the Big 12.

    We had to grab 2 schools and TCU and WV were great gets considering the pinch the B12 was in.

    As far as BYU goes, who knows how serious those talks were, but they were supposedly making big demands.
    As far as Memphis goes, they're a bottom feeder for a reason. WV and TCU are head and shoulders above Memphis.

    ---

    The bigger story is that in just a couple years, the B12 has turned the tables from an "unstable" conference that no ACC school would even consider joining to a "stable" situation. Why? Nienas, Grant of Rights, great TV money for the markets we have, and schools that actually want to be here.



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    Re: Conference expansion question

    Quote Originally Posted by cyman05 View Post
    If you remember back, the Big 12 was on the brink of collapse for the second year in a row. All ACC schools were off the table then as they should have been.

    Heck, we almost took Pitt, but when they heard the ACC invite was coming they ran there instead. Louisville by all accounts had an offer that they turned down because they didn't think much of the Big 12.

    We had to grab 2 schools and TCU and WV were great gets considering the pinch the B12 was in.

    As far as BYU goes, who knows how serious those talks were, but they were supposedly making big demands.
    As far as Memphis goes, they're a bottom feeder for a reason. WV and TCU are head and shoulders above Memphis.

    ---

    The bigger story is that in just a couple years, the B12 has turned the tables from an "unstable" conference that no ACC school would even consider joining to a "stable" situation. Why? Nienas, Grant of Rights, great TV money for the markets we have, and schools that actually want to be here.
    Yeah, I kinda forget just how desperate the Big 12 was back then. Makes sense. I just assumed that given the choice, WV and TCU wouldn't have been the teams we would choose to add, but at the time we didn't have much of a choice.

    I think if we expand again though, we should have more of a choice. I still think we need to get into Florida big time, just for TV sets and recruiting purposes.



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    Re: Conference expansion question

    Its complicated.

    First you have to understand that the way the big 12 makes money and the way the big 10 makes money are fairly different. The big 10 makes money in large part by charging every single cable customer within its footprint a higher amount, through the big 10 network. The big 12 makes money from its tv contract which is almost exclusively ratings-derived (ESPN\Fox pay the big 12 an amount based on the ratings it thinks it will get).

    Due to that, markets matter a lot to the big 10. With rutgers and maryland (and GT\FSU if that happened), getting cable deals is all that matters, even if the football brands are weak from those schools. With the big 12 we need ratings.

    Now, look back at the situation. We took TCU for a couple reasons. 1. they were a decent brand with their success lately. Not great, but decent. 2, and more importantly, as they were already in the midst of a conference change, they were available immediately. As a conference looking like it may fall apart if we didnt find a replacement for TAMU, we needed someone who could say 'we're in NOW'.

    As for WVU, after Syracuse and Pitt left for the ACC, this made them an easier grab. When Mizzou left, we were able to grab them up easier, and they had a pretty good football brand.

    As for other schools, none were leaving at the time, except possibly louisville (who we chose WV over). The big 12 looked very instable at the time and nobody was leaving the ACC\b10\sec\pac 10 at the time so that left big east and MWC possibilities.



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    Re: Conference expansion question

    Quote Originally Posted by clonedude View Post
    I think if we expand again though, we should have more of a choice. I still think we need to get into Florida big time, just for TV sets and recruiting purposes.
    I think we still play third fiddle though among potential ACC defections. The big 10 and SEC have to strike first. As long as the SEC sticks to its 'only one SEC school per state' thing we should have some decent options though.



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    Re: Conference expansion question

    Quote Originally Posted by alarson View Post
    I think we still play third fiddle though among potential ACC defections. The big 10 and SEC have to strike first. As long as the SEC sticks to its 'only one SEC school per state' thing we should have some decent options though.
    Yeah, it all depends on how Big the B10 gets. With all the talk of the Big 10 growing to 18 or 20, I just have a hard time seeing it. It took the conference what like 40 years to grow from 10 to 11 and another 20 years to go from 11 to 12. Now we're suppose to assume they're okay with adding 6-8 teams all at once? I personally have a hard time seeing them going past 16. Plus scheduling would be very tough at 18 or 20.

    Anyways, I think the B12 will have FSU, Miami, Clemson, Louisville, and possibly some combination of GA Tech, NC State, Va Tech, BYU, San Diego State to choose from.



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    Re: Conference expansion question

    TCU is all about the future. If TCU gets big in Texas they can bring a lot of t.v. sets.


    Nobody but HB knows for sure. You pretty much know nothing....like Knownothing would like to say.
    Word

  8. #8
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    Re: Conference expansion question

    Quote Originally Posted by Knownothing View Post
    TCU is all about the future. If TCU gets big in Texas they can bring a lot of t.v. sets.
    Did you read any of alarson's posts? The Big 12's revenue model is not based on TV sets.



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    Re: Conference expansion question

    Quote Originally Posted by cyman05 View Post
    Yeah, it all depends on how Big the B10 gets. With all the talk of the Big 10 growing to 18 or 20, I just have a hard time seeing it. It took the conference what like 40 years to grow from 10 to 11 and another 20 years to go from 11 to 12. Now we're suppose to assume they're okay with adding 6-8 teams all at once? I personally have a hard time seeing them going past 16. Plus scheduling would be very tough at 18 or 20.

    Anyways, I think the B12 will have FSU, Miami, Clemson, Louisville, and possibly some combination of GA Tech, NC State, Va Tech, BYU, San Diego State to choose from.
    Don't forget they just went to 14.

    But I agree with you that I doubt they are going above 16.



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    Re: Conference expansion question

    Quote Originally Posted by DistrictCyclone View Post
    Did you read any of alarson's posts? The Big 12's revenue model is not based on TV sets.
    Know. Nothing.

    An honest poster, at least.



  11. #11
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    Re: Conference expansion question

    Quote Originally Posted by cyman05 View Post
    I personally have a hard time seeing them going past 16. Plus scheduling would be very tough at 18 or 20.
    You could just have what amounts to a couple 9 or 10 team conferences. Play round robin within each conference, throw in a Big 10-Big 10 challenge game and you are done. As long as they can cash a big enough check I'm not sure the Big 10 really cares if Minnesota only travels to Georgia Tech once every 20 years.



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