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    Culture Run Afoul

    I keep hearing that the culture at Penn State was the root cause and these penalties are meant to right the ills at PSU and send a broader message throughout college athletics. I don't see it. Until universities take control over athletics and booster influence there will continue to be problems.

    If the NCAA is serious they need to look at the following:
    - Fundraising should be brought back under the university and there should not be separate AD foundations or sport specific fundraising entities (e.g. no gridiron clubs).
    - There need to be spending caps by sport. There is no reason for the out of control spending on men's FB & BB. The extravagence of practice facilities, lounges, etc sends the wrong message. At schools like PSU, OSU, UT, OU, etc the academic side of the universities should benefit from booster donations, ticket sales and media money.
    - Head coaches salaries are out of control. When the head FB & MBB coach make 5-10x what the university president is making- who has the power? What message does this send on priorities. If Sabin, Meyer, Stoops want to make huge $ coaching- go to the NFL.



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    Re: Culture Run Afoul

    You are not incorrect. Good luck with that!


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    Re: Culture Run Afoul

    Quote Originally Posted by isucy86 View Post
    I keep hearing that the culture at Penn State was the root cause and these penalties are meant to right the ills at PSU and send a broader message throughout college athletics. I don't see it. Until universities take control over athletics and booster influence there will continue to be problems.

    If the NCAA is serious they need to look at the following:
    - Fundraising should be brought back under the university and there should not be separate AD foundations or sport specific fundraising entities (e.g. no gridiron clubs).
    - There need to be spending caps by sport. There is no reason for the out of control spending on men's FB & BB. The extravagence of practice facilities, lounges, etc sends the wrong message. At schools like PSU, OSU, UT, OU, etc the academic side of the universities should benefit from booster donations, ticket sales and media money.
    - Head coaches salaries are out of control. When the head FB & MBB coach make 5-10x what the university president is making- who has the power? What message does this send on priorities. If Sabin, Meyer, Stoops want to make huge $ coaching- go to the NFL.

    Great post.



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    Re: Culture Run Afoul

    I don't neccesarily disagree with the theory behind your proposal, however, the university is simply offering a product to meet the demand of the people.

    I think the end game of your arguement is really that the demand of the donors are not inline with what you deem to be the the Univeristy's needs.

    Take that a step further and you will find yourself argueing that the profesional athletes shouldn't make more than teachers because teachers are more important than profesional sports. Not untrue, but also not inline with a free market society.


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    Re:Culture Run Afoul

    America as a whole has a culture problem it's not isolated to sports excesses .



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    Re: Culture Run Afoul

    Quote Originally Posted by isucy86 View Post
    I keep hearing that the culture at Penn State was the root cause and these penalties are meant to right the ills at PSU and send a broader message throughout college athletics. I don't see it. Until universities take control over athletics and booster influence there will continue to be problems.

    If the NCAA is serious they need to look at the following:
    - Fundraising should be brought back under the university and there should not be separate AD foundations or sport specific fundraising entities (e.g. no gridiron clubs).
    - There need to be spending caps by sport. There is no reason for the out of control spending on men's FB & BB. The extravagence of practice facilities, lounges, etc sends the wrong message. At schools like PSU, OSU, UT, OU, etc the academic side of the universities should benefit from booster donations, ticket sales and media money.
    - Head coaches salaries are out of control. When the head FB & MBB coach make 5-10x what the university president is making- who has the power? What message does this send on priorities. If Sabin, Meyer, Stoops want to make huge $ coaching- go to the NFL.
    Absolutely agree. Those that think it is PSU's unique culture should grab a mirror or look around.



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    Re: Culture Run Afoul

    The notions of "student-athlete" and "amateur" are terribly outdated.



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    Re: Culture Run Afoul

    Quote Originally Posted by swarthmoreCY View Post
    Absolutely agree. Those that think it is PSU's unique culture should grab a mirror or look around.
    When has ISU handled criminal activity internally?



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    To Some Degree it Happens at All Schools

    Quote Originally Posted by cyclonewino View Post
    When has ISU handled criminal activity internally?
    It's been a while, but I believe during Tim Floyd's time at ISU there was an issue. As a result Iowa State implemented a structured procedure for athletes who have legal problems. In that case I think it dealt more with the penalty imposed by the athletic department than covering up the incident.

    The thing that is so astonishing about PSU is it was the President and University VP in charge of campus cops who covered things up.



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    Re: Culture Run Afoul

    I'm not saying you're wrong, but I don't think there's a case to be made that Penn State's wrong doings were anything less than extreme. The highest officials at the university were covering up crimes that amounted in a 442 year maximum sentence for Sandusky when the trial was over, not to mention the hypocrisy of hiding this while trying to cultivate good men to go out into the world so they might be upstanding citizens.

    You're right, college athletics have grown to a debatably unhealthy popularity, but so much good that comes out of it as well. At the very base, it offers young men and women the opportunity to get a college education where it may not have been possible before. It's a source of regional pride. It creates jobs and spending through coaching staffs, athletic departments, equipment and clothing makers, television broadcasting, and more. And at the end of the day, it's fun.

    I don't think the situation with college athletics is so corrupt that we should completely revamp the system. Sure, there are improvements to be made, just like with anything in life. The Penn State scandal needs to serve as a reminder that the athletic culture certainly has potential to get in the way of what's really important, and the penalties are designed to drive the point home.



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    Re: Culture Run Afoul

    agree with the OP's premise, but that train has left the station. For me, when Iowa State was nearly left out of a big boy conference - I was ****** and writing letters to all sorts of elected officials - and now that we survived we speculate on how much more money we can get by adding x and y team? If the government can tax me at a set percentage based on the money I bring in then they could the NCAA schools too. Exemptions for coaches - 500K - everything above that subject to tax. That would change things quickly



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    Re: To Some Degree it Happens at All Schools

    Quote Originally Posted by isucy86 View Post
    The thing that is so astonishing about PSU is it was the President and University VP in charge of campus cops who covered things up.
    Ultimately it was Paterno who called the shots and covered it up.



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    Re: Culture Run Afoul

    Quote Originally Posted by isucy86 View Post
    I keep hearing that the culture at Penn State was the root cause and these penalties are meant to right the ills at PSU and send a broader message throughout college athletics. I don't see it. Until universities take control over athletics and booster influence there will continue to be problems.

    If the NCAA is serious they need to look at the following:
    - Fundraising should be brought back under the university and there should not be separate AD foundations or sport specific fundraising entities (e.g. no gridiron clubs).
    - There need to be spending caps by sport. There is no reason for the out of control spending on men's FB & BB. The extravagence of practice facilities, lounges, etc sends the wrong message. At schools like PSU, OSU, UT, OU, etc the academic side of the universities should benefit from booster donations, ticket sales and media money.
    - Head coaches salaries are out of control. When the head FB & MBB coach make 5-10x what the university president is making- who has the power? What message does this send on priorities. If Sabin, Meyer, Stoops want to make huge $ coaching- go to the NFL.
    I'd vote for that!



  14. #14
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    Re: Culture Run Afoul

    Good post-if these penalties do their job then in every university Preidents and ADs are talking and asking "This could not happen here, right?


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  15. #15
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    Re: Culture Run Afoul

    Quote Originally Posted by rainbowdolphin View Post
    Good post-if these penalties do their job then in every university Preidents and ADs are talking and asking "This could not happen here, right?
    You got it. In the media, many are asking "why punish the players, new coaches, etc at PSU because they didn't do anything? All the guilty are in jail, fired, or dead."

    But it's not about punishment. It's about DETERRENCE.

    I'd like to think this will change some things, but it won't.



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