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  1. #1
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    Legal Advice Needed! (LONG)

    I apologize if this comes across choppy and hard to read, but I'm pretty ****** right now so here's the story...

    As some of you may have seen, we have had 2 litters of beagle puppies for sale. We had 12 originally and are now down to 4. Well about a month ago, I got an email from a lady from England who was located currently in Canada and that wanted to buy a puppy for her son that was supposedly going to be going to college in Iowa. We came to an agreement, and she said that she was going to have her office send payment in the form of a money order. She then emailed a couple days later to say that they had screwed up and sent her whole paycheck ($2550), and that she would have her son pick up the extra when he came to get the dog.

    It took about 6 weeks, but the money orders finally came through. We were skeptical so we took them in to the bank that my wife works at and had them check them out. They told us they were legit, so we had the puppy part put into our account and a cashier's check made out for the extra to go to her son (we didn't want to have any of our account info involved just in case).

    Last week, she emails us to tell us that her son ran out of money and didn't have enough for a plane ticket back. She apparently couldn't wire him money from Canada, and wanted us to send him the money from the extra she had sent through Western Union. We debated about it, but she was going to pay us an extra 50 bucks, so we went ahead and sent it.
    After emailing to tell us that he had received it, she emailed back and said that for some reason with his documents he couldn't buy a one way ticket, so he needed more money for a round tripper. She wanted to send us another $4000 to wire to him for her, and that he would use the extra for apartment furnishing. I told her I wasn't comfortable handling that much money for somebody, and she said that she understood and that just $400 of the leftover would be enough to make it a round trip ticket. We finally decided to do that, and sent it off yesterday. She emailed today to say that he had gotten it and that she would be in contact to tell us when he would be getting in.

    Today my wife calls to tell me that the original money orders came back as counterfeit. I am freaking ****** about it and sick to my stomach, but I don't think that we would be able to be held liable for it since we never had anything go through our account. I emailed her to tell her we are looking forward to her son's arrival so he can get his puppy, and also that we have an extra $400 plus for him when he gets here and for her to email if he needs anything. I'm hoping to lay the carrot out there so we can bust him, but I called Western Union and they said that he had cashed both of the first 2 in London, and could actually cash it anywhere in the country. I also filed a report on the FBI online crime dept. site and am going to talk to the Ames PD as well.

    Any thoughts on what to do or whether or not I would be held responsible for the money when we went there to determine if it was a counterfeit or not?



    Im just glad I have Homan as my bodyguard, Eustachy joked. If I ever make it real big and get to drive a limo everyday, hell be driving it. I thought he came off the bench like somebody was stealing his cow or something.

    http://blogs.dmjuice.com/?cat=43

  2. #2
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    Re: Legal Advice Needed! (LONG)

    You're screwed and out the money. This is becoming a more and more common scam and the best advice is to not send back any amount for the difference. These people are even starting to counterfeit bank cashier's checks and US Treasury checks (this is a big deal because these are to be considered automatically good for funds availability).

    These people deserve a special place in hell.



  3. #3
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    Re: Legal Advice Needed! (LONG)

    They just had a special on stuff like this on Dateline. If it is out of the US, you are pretty much out of luck. I'm not sure about being responsible for the money, but sounds like you got royally screwed. Sorry man!



  4. #4
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    Re: Legal Advice Needed! (LONG)

    hind site: Always wait for ANY check to clear (7-10) days. Then return overpayment or whatever.

    Tough break for a fellow Cyclone, but I believe in the first post, you are screwed. Hopefully they will come by for the puppy (the carrot as you put it) and the PD is there to meet them too!

    Sorry about your situation.

    - keep.

    handed out sympathy rep...


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    Re: Legal Advice Needed! (LONG)

    Quote Originally Posted by tigershoops31 View Post
    I apologize if this comes across choppy and hard to read, but I'm pretty ****** right now so here's the story...

    As some of you may have seen, we have had 2 litters of beagle puppies for sale. We had 12 originally and are now down to 4. Well about a month ago, I got an email from a lady from England who was located currently in Canada and that wanted to buy a puppy for her son that was supposedly going to be going to college in Iowa. We came to an agreement, and she said that she was going to have her office send payment in the form of a money order. She then emailed a couple days later to say that they had screwed up and sent her whole paycheck ($2550), and that she would have her son pick up the extra when he came to get the dog.

    It took about 6 weeks, but the money orders finally came through. We were skeptical so we took them in to the bank that my wife works at and had them check them out. They told us they were legit, so we had the puppy part put into our account and a cashier's check made out for the extra to go to her son (we didn't want to have any of our account info involved just in case).

    Last week, she emails us to tell us that her son ran out of money and didn't have enough for a plane ticket back. She apparently couldn't wire him money from Canada, and wanted us to send him the money from the extra she had sent through Western Union. We debated about it, but she was going to pay us an extra 50 bucks, so we went ahead and sent it.
    After emailing to tell us that he had received it, she emailed back and said that for some reason with his documents he couldn't buy a one way ticket, so he needed more money for a round tripper. She wanted to send us another $4000 to wire to him for her, and that he would use the extra for apartment furnishing. I told her I wasn't comfortable handling that much money for somebody, and she said that she understood and that just $400 of the leftover would be enough to make it a round trip ticket. We finally decided to do that, and sent it off yesterday. She emailed today to say that he had gotten it and that she would be in contact to tell us when he would be getting in.

    Today my wife calls to tell me that the original money orders came back as counterfeit. I am freaking ****** about it and sick to my stomach, but I don't think that we would be able to be held liable for it since we never had anything go through our account. I emailed her to tell her we are looking forward to her son's arrival so he can get his puppy, and also that we have an extra $400 plus for him when he gets here and for her to email if he needs anything. I'm hoping to lay the carrot out there so we can bust him, but I called Western Union and they said that he had cashed both of the first 2 in London, and could actually cash it anywhere in the country. I also filed a report on the FBI online crime dept. site and am going to talk to the Ames PD as well.

    Any thoughts on what to do or whether or not I would be held responsible for the money when we went there to determine if it was a counterfeit or not?
    Always do your business face to face. Always. This net stuff scares the heck out of me.


    'tiny little text etched into her neck it said "jesus lived and died for all your sins." she's got blue black ink and it's scratched into her lower back. it said: "damn right i'll rise again." yeah, damn right you'll rise again.'

  6. #6
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    Re: Legal Advice Needed! (LONG)

    This was hard to follow - not critical - just a hard story to follow.

    So are you out money as it stands right now?



  7. #7
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    Re: Legal Advice Needed! (LONG)

    Are you out the thousands of dollars, or just the money the bank charges for returned checks and the 50 dollar fee for the western union?



  8. #8
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    Re: Legal Advice Needed! (LONG)

    Yeah I don't know the legal parts of it but I've learned never to use Western Union. It seems that almost all of the biggest scammers use it since it's easier to use world-wide that other types of payment. The security is very lax through Western Union so I'd recommend not ever using it, period. Just from past experience though on eBay and from other stories I've heard.

    I know that doesn't help you now but take it from somebody that has been scammed online even after being a very cautious and up-to-date person.


    A program isn't built on one player and it doesn't succeed because of one player, thus a program won't fail if it doesn't get that one player.

  9. #9
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    Re: Legal Advice Needed! (LONG)

    Wow that sucks. You also just wrote a really good final exam for commercial paper law school exam.

    I think you will be ok because you merely presented a counterfeit money order to the bank not knowing the money order to be counterfeit. I'm surprised this got by the bank.

    I would immediately contact Ames PD and be very forthright with what happened.



  10. #10
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    Re: Legal Advice Needed! (LONG)

    Thank god she wasn't trying to get a dog for a dog fighting ring

    That sucks, don't the Secret Service take care of this stuff or is that just counterfeit cash? I think the bank should be held liable if they said it was legit.


    "If you can't hear me, it's because I'm in parentheses."



  11. #11
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    Re: Legal Advice Needed! (LONG)

    Quote Originally Posted by ISUFan22 View Post
    This was hard to follow - not critical - just a hard story to follow.

    So are you out money as it stands right now?
    Not right now since we did everything through the bank, it's them that are out. However, I am worried that since they can't get anything out of the dirtbags that scammed me they will try to get it out of us. It also sucks that now the pup is 11 weeks old so we're out those 6 weeks that we could have found him a good home. I feel dumb for getting ripped, but that was the whole reason that we took it to the bank...we said we wanted to make sure we weren't being scammed.



    Im just glad I have Homan as my bodyguard, Eustachy joked. If I ever make it real big and get to drive a limo everyday, hell be driving it. I thought he came off the bench like somebody was stealing his cow or something.

    http://blogs.dmjuice.com/?cat=43

  12. #12
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    Re: Legal Advice Needed! (LONG)

    Well you tried to be a good person and that's what scammers go for, unfortunately. I wouldn't think you could be liable for anything since it's them that wrote the "checks" and you just cashed it after even asking them if it looked legit. I know several lawyers visit the site so hopefully they can provide you some free advice.


    A program isn't built on one player and it doesn't succeed because of one player, thus a program won't fail if it doesn't get that one player.

  13. #13
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    Re: Legal Advice Needed! (LONG)

    The bank wont hold you for that. They can take a loss. And it was their fault for allowing it in the first place.



  14. #14
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    Re: Legal Advice Needed! (LONG)

    Quote Originally Posted by Incyte View Post
    You also just wrote a really good final exam for commercial paper law school exam.
    Good point...you could send your story to some legal professors - they could pose it in a test to their students to see how they'd handle it.

    In all seriousness though - this is very odd. I agree with the other poster - I doubt the bank will hold you liable - yet I would be concerned if I were in your shoes.

    I'm guessing no one will be showing up for the dog if in fact this is a scam.



  15. #15
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    Re: Legal Advice Needed! (LONG)

    Did you guys ever seen that dateline nbc segment. To Catch a Scammer or whatever it was called. Awesome. I loved the look on the guys' faces when Chris Hanson busted them.



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