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    Former Student Athletes Sue NCAA for Compensation

    This suit is more significant as now the plaintiffs are allowed discovery within the NCAA's business records.This the first suit against the NCAA that has come this far.
    If this suit is successful, it will change the world of college sports like the super continent of Pangaea splitting apart changed the earth millions of years ago.


    Last edited by drednot57; 09-20-2010 at 12:46 PM.
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    Re: Former Student Athletes Sue NCAA for Compensation

    Quote Originally Posted by drednot57 View Post
    This suit is more significant as now the plaintiffs are allowed discovery within the NCAA's business records.This the first suit against the NCAA that has come this far.
    If this suit is successful, it will change the world of college sports like the super continent of Pangaea splitting apart changed the earth millions of years ago.
    Good for them. Never has it been more clear that College Football is about money and not student athletes than after last Summer. I'd think the Universities are just as guilty as the NCAA, but I guess you have to start with the body that writes the rules.



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    Re: Former Student Athletes Sue NCAA for Compensation

    Quote Originally Posted by RayShimley View Post
    I'd think the Universities are just as guilty as the NCAA, but I guess you have to start with the body that writes the rules.
    A.J. Green can't sell his actual game-worn jersey, but the school can sell racks and racks of replica jerseys with his number.



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    Re: Former Student Athletes Sue NCAA for Compensation

    Quote Originally Posted by RayShimley View Post
    Good for them. Never has it been more clear that College Football is about money and not student athletes than after last Summer. I'd think the Universities are just as guilty as the NCAA, but I guess you have to start with the body that writes the rules.
    Be careful what you hope for. If players are compensated based on their contribution to the NCAA's and their college's bottom line the players will have even more incentive to go to the big time programs (that's were they can win a Nat. Champ. and be on national TV regularly and thus get more money). The "rich" get "richer" and it will be even rarer that a player will eschew a big time program to be "the man" at a lesser known program.

    Besides, what is the value of a full ride scholarship in tuition, books, room and board (ever see what is available on a training table?), medical care, training facilities, tutoring, etc. I know that a regular undergraduate student can rack up a hell of a lot of debt in 4 or 5 years without blinking an eye.


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    Re: Former Student Athletes Sue NCAA for Compensation

    I think it might be fair to set it up like scholarships are. Each school has a certain amount of slots for paid players, at an amount, or amounts, determined by the ncaa. Say a fb team can have the same number of scholarships as current, but can only have something like 10 of those paid 20k. Wonder if you could actually structure it to create more parity as some athletes who would not be in the paid tier at a top 10 school, but would get a scholly offer, may move down a notch to get a check, and that could spread on downwards.

    If you just outright allowed schools to pay whatever they wanted, yeah, college football is done for.



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    Re: Former Student Athletes Sue NCAA for Compensation

    If we start paying payers everything will change and not for the better. Do they deserve something probably but paying them will make the product worse.



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    Re: Former Student Athletes Sue NCAA for Compensation

    Why stop at college? There are High School programs that make a profit.



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    Re: Former Student Athletes Sue NCAA for Compensation

    I see both sides of this argument. A little bit more for the players - but I also know what a slipper slope this creates if collegiate athletes start getting paid.



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    Re: Former Student Athletes Sue NCAA for Compensation

    Quote Originally Posted by theshadow View Post
    A.J. Green can't sell his actual game-worn jersey, but the school can sell racks and racks of replica jerseys with his number.
    Quote Originally Posted by VeloClone View Post
    Be careful what you hope for. If players are compensated based on their contribution to the NCAA's and their college's bottom line the players will have even more incentive to go to the big time programs (that's were they can win a Nat. Champ. and be on national TV regularly and thus get more money). The "rich" get "richer" and it will be even rarer that a player will eschew a big time program to be "the man" at a lesser known program.

    Besides, what is the value of a full ride scholarship in tuition, books, room and board (ever see what is available on a training table?), medical care, training facilities, tutoring, etc. I know that a regular undergraduate student can rack up a hell of a lot of debt in 4 or 5 years without blinking an eye.
    I agree with both points, and I honestly don't know how it can be fixed. But as TheShadow pointed out, stories like this seem insane to me: A.J. Green's only crime was trying to make a buck off A.J. Green - Dr. Saturday - NCAAF - Yahoo! Sports . The kid was clearly in the wrong as far as NCAA rules go, but the irony of letting the school make millions selling replica jerseys with his number on it is appalling.



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    Re: Former Student Athletes Sue NCAA for Compensation

    Quote Originally Posted by VeloClone View Post
    Besides, what is the value of a full ride scholarship in tuition, books, room and board (ever see what is available on a training table?), medical care, training facilities, tutoring, etc. I know that a regular undergraduate student can rack up a hell of a lot of debt in 4 or 5 years without blinking an eye.
    I think once "real dollars" start getting assinged to these things, the compensation is going to look pretty darn good for a 18-22 year-old kid.

    The legal problem for the NCAA is O'Bannon's claim that the NCAA is making players sign a wavier to future marketing rights, and what that waiver really entails. If a walk-on is forced to sign such a waiver without getting compensation (i.e. a scholarship), then I see a problem.

    The solution could be pretty simple. If a player takes any assistance (i.e tuition, room, food, tutoring, etc.), that player is subject to the stipulations put on that assistance by those offering it. If the player does not want to be subject to those stipulations, allow that player to walk-on and pay his/her own way.


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    Re: Former Student Athletes Sue NCAA for Compensation

    Let's keep focus on the basis for this lawsuit: post-collegiate compensation.

    Yes, this can still be the start (or steepening) of a slippery slope, but the money the players are chasing in this lawsuit is based on the continued commercialization of their likeness after they finish their college careers. The issue at hand isn't about increasing a living stipend for current players, but rather allowing players to receive a financial benefit from the use of their image after their collegiate career (e.g., they're arguing that Fred Hoiberg should receive a cut for every Hoiberg jersey sold after his graduation, or that the same should apply for Troy Davis and his football jerseys).



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    Re: Former Student Athletes Sue NCAA for Compensation

    Quote Originally Posted by iahawkhunter View Post
    Let's keep focus on the basis for this lawsuit: post-collegiate compensation.

    Yes, this can still be the start (or steepening) of a slippery slope, but the money the players are chasing in this lawsuit is based on the continued commercialization of their likeness after they finish their college careers. The issue at hand isn't about increasing a living stipend for current players, but rather allowing players to receive a financial benefit from the use of their image after their collegiate career (e.g., they're arguing that Fred Hoiberg should receive a cut for every Hoiberg jersey sold after his graduation, or that the same should apply for Troy Davis and his football jerseys).
    So if someone buys a #28 football jersey the money should go to Troy Davis or Darren Davis? What about every Iowa State player who wore #28 before a Davis?

    Should Jake Anderson get a cut of every #5 jersey that is purchased to honor Marcus Fizer? Should Jake's family and friend's money go to Marcus when they buy a #5 jersey to support Jake?

    #14 is retired. Does money go to Hornacek or Wegner? Or does it go equally to every player who ever wore that number?


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    Re: Former Student Athletes Sue NCAA for Compensation

    Quote Originally Posted by iahawkhunter View Post
    The issue at hand isn't about increasing a living stipend for current players, but rather allowing players to receive a financial benefit from the use of their image after their collegiate career (e.g., they're arguing that Fred Hoiberg should receive a cut for every Hoiberg jersey sold after his graduation, or that the same should apply for Troy Davis and his football jerseys).
    A similar claim could be made by many, many people who developed something at Company A and then moved on to another company, where Company A continues to derive revenue from the product after the developer has left. Such claims aren't made because employment agreements generally stipulate that any work and profit generated from an employee's work belong to the Company. If you don't like the agreement, you don't sign it and go to work elsewhere.

    Ed O'Bannon wasn't forced to play NCAA college basketball. It was his choice to sign the NCAA waiver and any stipulations made by the waiver. Back in his day, he could have declared for the NBA draft, gone overseas, played NAIA, etc.


    Last edited by jbhtexas; 09-20-2010 at 10:05 PM.
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    Re: Former Student Athletes Sue NCAA for Compensation

    Quote Originally Posted by jbhtexas View Post
    A similar claim could be made by many, many people who developed something at Company A and then moved on to another company, where Company A continues to derive revenue from the product after the developer has left. Such claims aren't made because employment agreements generally stipulate that any work and profit generated from an employee's work belong to the Company. If you don't like the agreement, you don't sign it and go to work elsewhere.

    Ed O'Bannon wasn't forced to play NCAA college basketball. It was his choice to sign the NCAA waiver and any stipulations made by the waiver. Back in his day, he could have declared for the NBA draft, gone oversees, played NAIA, etc.

    ^^^^ I agree with the above.

    If I could get royalties for past products I helped develop.



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    Re: Former Student Athletes Sue NCAA for Compensation

    Quote Originally Posted by VeloClone View Post
    So if someone buys a #28 football jersey the money should go to Troy Davis or Darren Davis? What about every Iowa State player who wore #28 before a Davis?

    Should Jake Anderson get a cut of every #5 jersey that is purchased to honor Marcus Fizer? Should Jake's family and friend's money go to Marcus when they buy a #5 jersey to support Jake?

    #14 is retired. Does money go to Hornacek or Wegner? Or does it go equally to every player who ever wore that number?
    I don't know how to best-address those issues. I was simply using Troy Davis jerseys as an illustration of post-collegiate sales. There's probably no good, simple answer since ISU doesn't always have names on jerseys. Sure, that wouldn't solve Troy vs. Darren Davis, but it would be an improvement (although this is probably a reason for not putting names on commercially-sold jerseys).

    Quote Originally Posted by jbhtexas View Post
    A similar claim could be made by many, many people who developed something at Company A and then moved on to another company, where Company A continues to derive revenue from the product after the developer has left. Such claims aren't made because employment agreements generally stipulate that any work and profit generated from an employee's work belong to the Company. If you don't like the agreement, you don't sign it and go to work elsewhere.

    Ed O'Bannon wasn't forced to play NCAA college basketball. It was his choice to sign the NCAA waiver and any stipulations made by the waiver. Back in his day, he could have declared for the NBA draft, gone oversees, played NAIA, etc.
    Good point. Your earlier post pointing out the difference between a scholarship player signing-away commercial rights and a walk-on signing-away those rights was also excellent. However, I think that the NCAA wields a lot more control over their market than almost any corporation does over theirs, and as a result the lawsuit may still have grounds on anti-competitive practices.



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